Aug 15, 2023 Board of Supervisors

[1* Yorktown Waterfront Initiatives. Receive an update from Neil Morgan. ]

THINGS THAT, UH, WE ARE WORKING ON AS A COUNTY STAFF AT THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT.

UH, THIS EVENING WE HAVE, UH, ONE PRESENTATION.

UH, IT'S ON THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT INITIATIVES.

AND, UH, MR. MORGAN, THANK YOU.

GOOD EVENING, EVERYONE.

UH, THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS GOING ON IN YORKTOWN, AND PARTICULARLY THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT.

THERE'S A LOT OF POSITIVE ENERGY, THERE'S SOME NEGATIVE ENERGY.

SO I THOUGHT IT'D BE APPROPRIATE FOR ME TO JUST, UH, TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT SOME OF THE DIFFERENT THINGS GOING ON AND GIVE EVERYONE MY PERSPECTIVE.

SO EVERY YEAR I SPEAK, UH, WITH THE YORK COUNTY YOUTH COMMISSION, AND I ASK, ONE OF THE QUESTIONS I ALWAYS ASK IS, WHAT POSITIVE IMAGE COMES TO MIND WHEN THEY THINK OF YORK COUNTY, AND WHERE DO THEY TAKE RELATIVES AND OUT OF TOWN? FRIENDS OVER THE YEARS, ALMOST ALL OF THEM ANSWER YORKTOWN AND ESPECIALLY THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT.

SO THERE'S SEVERAL DIFFERENT

[00:05:01]

AND THESE INITIATIVES ARE NOT DIRECTLY RELATED, UH, AND THEY EACH HAVE A DIFFERENT HISTORY, BUT TAKEN TOGETHER, THEY DO HAVE SOME SYNERGY, UH, AS THE COUNTY AND THE PRIVATE SECTOR CONTINUE TO INVEST IN WHAT I LIKE TO CALL THE COUNTY'S LIVING ROOM.

AND WHILE IT'S CERTAINLY IMPORTANT TO TALK ABOUT HOW THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT RELATES TO OUR TOURISM ECONOMY, UH, THAT IS REALLY NOT WHY, UH, PRIOR LEADERS IN THIS COMMUNITY CAME TOGETHER, UH, TO BUILD THE CONTEMPORARY YORKTOWN WATERFRONT.

UM, THEY DID THAT BECAUSE THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT IS A PLACE THAT BELONGS TO ALL 71,000 RESIDENTS OF YORK COUNTY.

NO COMMUNITY REALLY THRIVES UNLESS THERE IS A CENTRAL CIVIC PLACE THAT BELONGS TO ALL OF US.

UM, AND I THINK MOST OF US WOULD AGREE, REGARDLESS OF HOW WE FEEL ABOUT ANY PARTICULAR ISSUE, THAT THAT PLACE IS YORKTOWN AND THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT.

AND I CERTAINLY FEEL THAT, UH, AS A COMMUNITY, WE NEED TO CONTINUALLY REINVEST IF WE WANT TO THAT, UH, WATERFRONT TO BE THAT SPECIAL PLACE IT IS NOW FOR THE NEXT GENERATION.

SO, AS I SAID, THE, YOU KNOW, THE REASON TO INVEST IS FIRST AND FOREMOST ABOUT MAINTAINING THAT SPECIAL PLACE.

BUT IT IS IMPORTANT FOR CITIZENS TO KEEP IN THE BACK OF THEIR MIND, UH, WHAT THE TOURIST ECONOMY MEANS FOR YOUR COUNTY.

WHY SHOULD YOU CARE IF YOU ARE A RESIDENT ABOUT THE TOURISM ECONOMY? WELL, FIRST FACT, THE WAY IS THAT SEVEN OF OUR 10 LARGEST REAL ESTATE TAXPAYERS ARE TOURISTS ORIENTED BUSINESSES.

MUCH OF OUR SALES TAX MEALS, TAX, CIGARETTE TAX, AND MOST OF THE LODGING TAX ARE PAID BY VISITORS AND NOT RESIDENTS.

WITHOUT THE TOURISM ECONOMY, OUR LOCAL TAXES PAID BY YORK COUNTY CITIZENS WOULD BE SUBSTANTIALLY HIGHER THAN THEY ARE.

THAT'S JUST A FACT.

NOW, TOURISM ISN'T WITHOUT ITS NEGATIVE CHALLENGES THAT WE COULD TALK ABOUT.

UM, BUT THE, ONE OF THE MOST POSITIVE FEATURES OF A LOCALITY THAT HAS A MAJOR TOURIST, UH, SECTOR IS THAT THE PUBLIC AND PRIVATE INVESTMENTS THAT ARE TOURIST ORIENTED, UH, TO ENHANCE THE TOURIST EXPERIENCE DIRECTLY ENHANCE THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR THE CITIZENS AT THE SAME TIME.

SO YOU KIND OF GET A TWOFER .

SO EVERYTHING I'M SPEAKING ABOUT TONIGHT SHOULD BE UNDERSTOOD IN THE CONTEXT OF THE AMAZING JOB THIS COMMUNITY DID IN CREATING THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT.

I FEEL LIKE IT'S THE SINGLE MOST SUCCESSFUL THING IN THE, IN THE MODERN ERA THAT YORK COUNTY HAS EVER BEEN INVOLVED IN.

AND I CAN'T TAKE ANY CREDIT FOR IT.

IT WAS DONE LONG BEFORE I GOT HERE.

CONSTRUCTION OF THE ORIGINAL RIVERWALK WAS COMPLETED IN 2005 AFTER YEARS OF PLANNING.

AND EVERYONE HAS THEIR SPIN AND THEIR PERSPECTIVE, BUT I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO READ FOR YOURSELF THE STORY OF HOW ALL THAT WAS DONE.

UM, THERE'S AN EXCELLENT AND VERY THOROUGH REPORT ON OUR WEBSITE@YORKCOUNTY.GOV.

IF YOU GO DOWN ON THE LOWER LEFT CORNER TO THE COUNTY RESOURCES AND REPORTS, IT TALKS ABOUT ALL THAT WAS INVOLVED IN $2,005.

THE COUNTY INVESTED $31 MILLION IN THAT.

IN TODAY'S DOLLARS, IT'S PROBABLY A HUNDRED MILLION.

SO TONIGHT, THE BOARD, UH, WILL BE VOTING ON, UM, THE DOCK MASTER BUILDING.

BUT THE FIRST THING I WANTED TO TALK ABOUT WAS OUR SIDEWALK ENHANCEMENTS.

OVER THE LAST FIVE YEARS, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS HAS INVESTED IN ADDITIONAL SIDEWALKS IN YOUR TOWN THAT NOW CIRCUMNAVIGATE THE VILLAGE, A GREAT AMENITY FOR THE RESIDENTS, BUT ALSO FOR ALL OF US AS WE COME DOWN TO ENJOY THE WATER IN YOURTOWN, THE DOCK MASTER BUILDING, WHICH, UH, HAS RECEIVED SOME ATTENTION AS ON YOUR AGENDA TONIGHT, THERE'S A SERIES OF ACTIONS, AND WE'LL TALK ABOUT THAT MORE A LITTLE BIT LATER.

UH, BUT I DID WANNA SAY THAT THIS IS THE CURRENT FACILITY, THE BATHROOM AND THE DOCK MASTER BUILDING.

WE HAVE HAD IN OUR CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROGRAM, A, A PROJECT TO REPLACE THAT SINCE, UH, 2018.

AND, YOU KNOW, IT ALL STARTED

[00:10:01]

WITH THE FACT THAT WE DON'T HAVE YEAR-ROUND BATHROOMS. WE DON'T HAVE A D A ACCESSIBLE BATHROOMS. AND THE OTHER THING THAT WE HAVE LEARNED OVER THE YEARS IS HOW, UM, THAT FACILITY HAS EVOLVED INTO BASICALLY THE OPERATIONAL COMMAND CENTER FOR ALL EVENTS RELATED TO THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT.

UH, WHETHER IT IS FIRST AID TOURIST INFORMATION, UH, MANAGING THE COMINGS AND GOINGS FROM THE DOCKS, OR FACILITATING THE APPROXIMATELY 70 COMMUNITY EVENTS WE HAVE IN YORKTOWN.

SO, UH, PEOPLE CAN DISAGREE ABOUT THE DESIGN, THE LOCATION, UH, THE CASE THAT WE REALLY NEED.

THIS FACILITY, UH, IS, IS PRETTY STRONG, AND WE NEED TO EITHER GO AHEAD AND DO IT OR STOP TALKING ABOUT IT.

THAT IS THE ARTIST RENDERING.

THIS PARTICULAR, UH, ARCHITECT LIKES TO MAKE MODELS.

SOMETIMES I THINK THE MODELS MAY BE, AREN'T AS FLATTERING AS SOME OTHER TYPE OF RENDERING.

UM, BUT WE HIRED THE ARCHITECT THAT DID THE DESIGN OF ALL OF THE RIVERWALK LANDING STRUCTURES WITH THE, TO BE INTENTIONAL TO MAKE SURE THAT IT WAS A DESIGN THAT WAS COMPATIBLE WITH OTHER THINGS IN YORKTOWN.

AND AGAIN, WE WILL TAKE THIS AS AN AGENDA ITEM LATER, BUT THAT IS JUST ONE OF THE, UH, PICTURES THAT JUXTAPOSES THE NEW BUILDING IN RELATIONSHIP TO THE FOOTPRINT OF THE TWO EXISTING STRUCTURES THAT WOULD BE DEMOLISHED IF WE PROCEED.

, I MENTIONED ALL THE DIFFERENT THINGS THAT GO ON AT OUR WATERFRONT, INCLUDING THE 70 MAJOR EVENTS.

ANOTHER AREA WE'VE HAD GREAT SUCCESS, AND I THINK FOR THE MOST PART, THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF POSITIVE ENERGY IS ENCOURAGING THE VISITS OF TALL SHIPS.

AND THAT IS ANOTHER THING THAT, UM, OUR SMALL TEAM THAT WORKS OUT OF THE DOCK MASTERS FACILITY, UH, HAS TO MANAGE RIVER WALK LANDING.

I RECALL THAT THE COUNTY OWNS ALL OF THE, UH, RETAIL BUILDINGS IN THE MODERN, UH, RIVERWALK AREA.

THIS BUILDING'S ABOUT 20 YEARS OLD.

AS, AS THE BOARD KNOWS, WE ARE WORKING ON A PLAN WITH THE E D A AND THE CURRENT TENANT TO REFRESH THAT BUILDING, UH, CREATE MORE OF A OUTDOOR FOCUS AND SORT OF COMBINE THE TWO DIFFERENT FACILITIES INTO ONE LARGER, UH, RESTAURANT.

IT IS TRUE THAT WE HAVE BEEN FRUSTRATED WITH, UH, BIDS FOR THIS SUPPLY CHAIN ISSUES, PRICING, UM, AND WE HAVEN'T QUITE FIGURED IT OUT YET.

UH, WE ARE HOPEFUL THAT, UH, WE'LL BE ABLE TO IDENTIFY A WAY FORWARD THIS FALL.

BUT, UM, THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT STRUCTURE, THE LARGEST BUSINESS ON THE WATERFRONT, AND IT'S A COUNTY FACILITY THAT WE NEED TO, UH, PROTECT OUR INVESTMENT IN.

AND THIS REALLY, UH, CAME ABOUT IN PART BECAUSE OF THE LITTLE CONUNDRUM WE HAD WITH THE, UH, TENTS, UH, THAT YOU RECALL LAST YEAR.

THE BOARD, UH, AGREED TO ALLOW LARRY'S AND THE PUB TO KEEP THEIR TENT FOR ONE MORE YEAR.

AND YOU ASKED ME TO SEE IF WE COULDN'T COME UP WITH A, A BETTER WAY TO, UM, DEAL WITH THIS IN THE LONG RUN, I THINK WE WOULD ALL AGREE, UH, THAT IS NOT A PARTICULARLY ATTRACTIVE LOOK.

SO I'M PLEASED TO REPORT THAT, UM, WE HAVE MADE SOME PROGRESS.

THE FIRST THING EVERYONE SHOULD KNOW IS THAT, UM, LARRY'S IS BEING NOTIFIED THAT, UH, THEIR PERMISSION TO OPERATE A 10 HAS EXPIRED, AND WE EXPECT THEM TO COMPLY WITH THEIR PREVIOUSLY PERMITTED OUTDOOR DINING, WHICH WAS AN UMBRELLA ARRANGEMENT.

UM, DIDN'T ESCAPE OUR NOTICE THAT FOR, UH, MANY MONTHS, UH, LARRY'S REALLY WASN'T OPEN.

AND SO THE ARGUMENT THAT THEY NEEDED TENT, UH, WAS, BECAME PRETTY WEAK.

SO THAT ONE'S GOING AWAY.

THE, UM, PUB IS A DIFFERENT SITUATION.

I THINK WE'VE ALL OBSERVED, UM, HOW BUSY THE PUB IS.

IT'S ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT BRANDS IN THE YORKTOWN WATERFRONT.

[00:15:01]

AND WHAT'S REALLY EXCITING IS, UH, BOTH THE OWNER OF THE HOTEL AND THE OWNERS OF THE PUB ARE PLANNING ON AND IN SOME CASES ALREADY MAKING NEW INVESTMENTS IN THEIR PROPERTY.

AND WE WANNA WORK WITH 'EM TO TRY TO MAKE OUR PEDESTRIAN AND TRAFFIC SAFETY IMPROVEMENTS AND OUR ANESTHETIC IMPROVEMENTS IN A MANNER CONSISTENT WITH THEIR PLANS.

UM, MANY OF YOU ALL SAW OUR, UM, LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT CONSULTANTS IDEAS ABOUT WHAT YOU COULD DO ON THE WARD SIDE.

THIS IS JUST ONE RENDERING THE EXCITING NEW INFORMATION.

UH, JUST YESTERDAY, UH, THE OWNER OF A HUB, UM, SHARED SOME NEW RENDERINGS.

UH, THEY HAVE HIRED AN ARCHITECT AND ARE ACTIVELY WORKING ON A, A RENOVATION AND EXPANSION PLAN.

UH, AND THOSE ARE THE NEW RENDERINGS.

UH, THEY PLAN TO, UH, THIS FALL, UH, SUBMIT THEIR CONCEPT DRAWINGS TO THE, UM, HISTORIC YORKTOWN REVIEW, UH, COMMITTEE AND GET SOME INPUT.

AND SO, UH, UNLESS THE BOARD DIRECTS ME OTHERWISE, WHAT I'VE COMMUNICATED TO THE PUB IS SO LONG AS THEY'RE WORKING WITH US IN GOOD FAITH WITH THIS RATHER SUBSTANTIAL AND ATTRACTIVE RENOVATION, UH, WE WOULD BE OKAY WITH THEIR TANK CONTINUING UNTIL WE SEE OUR WAY THROUGH THAT PROCESS.

UM, ONE LAST THING ABOUT THE, UH, PEDESTRIAN, UH, AND AESTHETIC IMPROVEMENTS ON THAT SIDE, UH, IT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT CONSULTANT HAD RECOMMENDED, AND WE WERE PURSUING THIS KIND OF SEPARATELY FROM ALL THE OTHER MORE COMPLICATED THINGS THAT INVOLVE CIVIL ENGINEERING AND COORDINATING WITH, UH, PRIVATE BUSINESSES.

AND THAT'S A, UH, AESTHETIC UPGRADE OF THE, OF THE CHURCH STREET STAIRWELL.

NOT CHANGING THE BASIC, UH, STRUCTURE, UH, BUT, UH, ADDITIONAL LANDSCAPING AND SCREENING.

AND SO WE HOPE TO, UM, ACTUALLY DO SOME OF THAT WORK THIS FALL.

SO FINALLY, UH, I GUESS I SHOULD MENTION, PRINCESS CRUZ LOT HAS BEEN SAID, UH, SUGGESTIONS ABOUT, UM, YOU KNOW, HOW LONG THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON, WHO KNEW WHAT, WHAT THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN ALL OF THAT WAS AND THESE OTHER THINGS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

AND SO I'LL JUST TELL YOU FROM MY PERSPECTIVE WHAT HAPPENED ABOUT A YEAR AGO.

UH, PRINCESS CRUZ APPROACHED THE COUNTY.

UM, WHEN I FIRST HEARD ABOUT IT, UM, ALL OF THE QUESTIONS I HAD WERE VERY SIMILAR TO A LOT OF THE QUESTIONS THAT PEOPLE THAT HAVE BEEN CONCERNED ABOUT IT, UH, HAVE RAISED, UH, SCALE, UM, CROWD IMPACT, UH, ENVIRONMENT IMPACT ON THE COLEMAN BRIDGE.

HOW DID THE NAVY FEEL? THE, THE SHIPS IN THE RIVER? AND, UH, I ULTIMATELY, UH, HAD A SINGLE MEETING WITH, UH, MR. PAGEANT, UH, THE PRESIDENT OF THE COMPANY.

AND I LEARNED THAT, YOU KNOW, A BUNCH OF PEOPLE AROUND HERE KNEW HIM AND WENT TO HIGH SCHOOL WITH HIM.

AND HE DISCOVERED THAT HE WAS QUITE WELL INFORMED ABOUT YORK COUNTY AND YORKTOWN VILLAGE.

I TICKED OFF ALL OF THOSE CONCERNS, AND HE HAD, UM, A PRETTY GOOD ANSWER TO ALMOST ALL OF THEM.

UH, AND AT THE END OF THAT MEETING, UH, THE WAY WE LEFT IT, WHICH IS WHAT IS PLAYING OUT NOW, IS, YOU KNOW, SOMEDAY IN THE FUTURE, MAYBE THERE'S GONNA BE SOME KIND OF PERMANENT PROJECT AT THE WATERS MEN'S MUSEUM.

BUT THERE IS NO PLAN.

THERE IS NO MONEY, THERE IS NO SCHEDULE.

UH, THAT'S A SOMEDAY MAYBE THING.

AND WHAT THEY'RE REALLY TALKING ABOUT IS THREE TO FIVE ONE DAY VISITS STARTING NEXT YEAR.

UH, THEY HAVE A COAST GUARD ALLOCATED PLACE TO PARK IN THE RIVER.

DOESN'T INVOLVE OPENING THE COLEMAN BRIDGE.

IT'S QUITE A DISTANCE OFFSHORE.

UM, THEY WOULD TENDER PEOPLE IN TO OUR PIER, SO IT WOULD BE, UH, UNDER OUR CONTROL.

THEY CAN'T COME ON DAYS.

WE THINK IT'S BAD IN TERMS OF SCALE.

UH, AT LEAST HALF OF THE 70 EVENTS WE CURRENTLY HAVE IN YOURTOWN INVOLVE MORE PEOPLE WITH CARS, UH, THAN WILL BE INVOLVED IN THESE EXPERIMENTAL PILOT CRUISES, UH, WITH PEOPLE SHOWING UP WITH ZERO CARS.

UM, SO I WOULD JUST SAY I WISH FOLKS WOULD BE OPEN-MINDED AND LET'S SEE HOW IT PLAYS OUT.

AND IF THEY DO THIS, UH, AND IT BECOMES OBVIOUS, THAT'S A PROBLEM, IT WILL GO AWAY.

AND IF THEY DO IT AND BECOMES OBVIOUS, IT'S A GOOD THING, UH, MAYBE THEY'LL DO MORE.

AND THAT'S ALL THAT'S ON THE TABLE RIGHT NOW.

SO, UM, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, THAT CONCLUDES MY REMARKS FOR NOW, AND BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS OR PERHAPS LATER IN THE MEETING WILL BE ANOTHER OPPORTUNITY.

, UM, WE'RE NOT CHANGING THE ACTUAL STAIRS.

UH, CHAD, YOU, ANY QUESTIONS? SURE.

THE CHURCH STREET STAIRWELL WE HAD TALKED ABOUT MM-HMM.

[00:20:01]

WE'RE PUTTING MORE PLANTS, PLANTS AND THINGS.

BECAUSE IT, I'VE, I'VE SEEN TWO DIFFERENT YEP.

RENDERINGS, THE, THE, UH, THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT SUGGESTED A DIFFERENT CONFIGURATION, AND HONESTLY, WE JUST THOUGHT THAT THAT WAS A, IT WOULD BE AN UNNECESSARY EXPENSE, YOU KNOW, TO, TO SORT OF REDESIGN THAT AND DIFFERENT CONCRETE WORK AND ALL THAT.

AND THE THING THAT IT SEEMED LIKE MOST PEOPLE AGREED WITH WAS THE IDEA THAT YOU COULD FRESHEN IT UP AND IMPROVE THE AESTHETICS BY SOME LANDSCAPING ALONG THAT CORRIDOR THAT THE COUNTY ALREADY OWNS.

AND ALSO WITH THE PERMISSION OF THE OWNER OF THE PUB.

AND MR. GRANGER HAS VERBALLY INDICATED HE WOULDN'T HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH IT.

WE'LL ALSO DO SOME LANDSCAPING ON THE BLUFF, UM, IN ADDITION TO WHERE WE HAVE PROPERTY.

LET'S TALK TENTS FOR A MINUTE.

UH, LARRY'S TENT IS COMING DOWN.

YEP.

, THE PUB'S TENT IS STAYING UP BECAUSE THEY ARE WORKING ON A PLAN TO, UH, TO, UH, RENOVATE AND EXPAND THE PUB.

AND MOST SPECIFICALLY, UM, THEY ARE PROPOSING A, UH, RAISED PLATFORM, OUTDOOR EATING AREA, UH, IN THE AREA WHERE THE TENT AND THE PARKING AND THE DUMPSTERS ARE CURRENTLY.

AND ALL OF THAT, OF COURSE, WOULD REQUIRE, UM, UH, COORDINATION WITH THE COUNTY, UH, DESIGN REVIEW, APPROVAL, YOU KNOW, SITE PLANS, BUILDING PLANS.

SO THAT'S WAYS INTO THE FUTURE.

UH, BUT WHAT I HEARD FROM THE BOARD LAST YEAR WAS, UM, LET'S WORK ON COMING UP WITH A, A PERMANENT DESIGN AND A PERMANENT ARRANGEMENT THAT, YOU KNOW, IS A LOT MORE ATTRACTIVE.

AND, UH, MR. GRANGER, WHO ACTUALLY OWNS THE LAND AND THE STRUCTURES, UH, WE'VE ESTABLISHED A DIALOGUE WITH HIM.

UH, HE IS PREPARED TO MAKE A MULTIMILLION DOLLAR INVESTMENT IN THE PUB, INCLUDING AN OUTDOOR DINING ARRANGEMENT THAT THIS, THIS IS A ARCHITECT'S RENDERING OF WHAT IT MIGHT LOOK LIKE.

IT, IT WOULD NEED MULTIMILLION DOLLARS.

AND HE SAYS HE'S PREPARED TO DO IT, UM, IF FOLKS CAN GET BEHIND WHAT HE WANTS TO DO.

THANK YOU SHEILA.

I, I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD RIGHT NOW.

STEVEN, A COUPLE QUESTIONS.

UM, DO YOU KNOW IF THE ARCHITECTS WITH THE PUB OR IN COLLABORATION WITH THE ARCHITECTS REHIRE FOR THE, FOR THE BIGGER DESIGN PICTURE? SO THEY'RE WORKING TOGETHER, DO YOU KNOW? UM, I DON'T THINK IT'S ADVANCED TO THAT POINT.

I MEAN, BASICALLY, UH, WHAT WHAT WE ARE DOING IS PRELIMINARY CIVIL ENGINEERING WORK.

UH, LIKE COULD YOU HAVE A, UH, CHANGE THE PARKING ARRANGEMENT? DOES THE WATER LINE, CAN IT COME A DIFFERENT WAY? SO AT SOME POINT THERE DETAILED DESIGN AND WHAT'RE WORKING, WHAT WE'RE WORKING ON, WE'LL HAVE TO INTEGRATE.

UM, BETH MERCK GWEN, ONE OF OUR SENIOR ENGINEERS WHO'S IN THE, IN THE, UH, STADIUM, UH, IS PROBABLY THE MOST KNOWLEDGEABLE PERSON WE HAVE ABOUT ALL THE DIFFERENT MOVING PARTS.

SO THE WILL REQUIRE A LOT OF COORDINATION, AND PART OF IT'S A CHICKEN AND EGG THING, RIGHT? WE KIND OF NEED TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY WANT TO DO, WHAT THEY'RE PREPARED TO DO, AND THEN HOW DOES THAT TRUE UP WITH OUR THOUGHTS? AND I THINK THIS HAS BEEN REPORTED IN OTHER WRITTEN MATERIAL THAT WE'VE SENT YOU, BUT, YOU KNOW, OUR, OUR LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT THROUGHOUT ALL KINDS OF IDEAS.

AND, UM, YOU ALL BASICALLY SAID, KEEP WORKING ON IT, BUT TIGHTEN IT UP.

AND SO WHAT WE'VE LANDED ON IS WE ARE NOT PROPOSING TO CHANGE THE TWO-WAY CIRCULATION.

WE WANNA KEEP THE TWO-WAY CIRCULATION.

UH, BUT THERE ARE SOME OPPORTUNITIES TO, UM, UPGRADE THE PARKING, THE LANDSCAPING, PUT A SIDEWALK ON THE WARD SIDE.

IF YOU'RE DOWN THERE ON A BUSY DAY, YOU SEE PEOPLE, UH, WALKING OUT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE ROAD GOING BETWEEN THE HOTEL AND THE WATERFRONT.

YOU SEE 'EM WALKING ALONG THAT TWO FOOT GRANITE STRIP ON THE BEACH SIDE, WHICH I GUESS WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A, JUST A DESIGN AMENITY.

IT'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE A SIDEWALK.

AND, UM, SO THERE'S SOME ROOM TO MAKE SOME ADJUSTMENTS AND, UM, YOU KNOW, VDI WATERWORKS AND, AND OTHERS WILL HAVE TO PLAY IN ALL OF THAT.

AND THE SECOND QUESTION, THIS MAY BE TO ASK THIS TOO, BUT IT GOT ME CURIOUS, WHERE ARE WE GONNA, WHERE WERE THOSE DUMPSTERS AND ALL THOSE OTHER THINGS THAT ARE THERE TODAY WHERE WE GET RELOCATED TO? THERE'S NOT A LOT OF SPACES.

UH, UM, SO, UH, MR. UH, GRANGER AND, AND THE, THE, THE GENTLEMAN THAT OWNED THE PUB HAVE SOME IDEAS ABOUT THAT.

THREE TO TWO, AND THEY CAN PROBABLY BE RELOCATED.

UM, AND THEN IT'S ALSO POSSIBLE THERE'S, THERE'S ONE THAT SERVES, UH, THE HOTEL AND THERE'S TWO THAT SERVE LARRY'S AND THE PUB.

AND THEY CAN, THEY CAN PROBABLY GO DOWN FROM

[00:25:01]

STAY TUNED.

WELL, JUST A, UM, A SHORT COMMENT, UH, KEEP IN MIND THAT, UM, THIS BOARD ULTIMATELY WILL MAKE A DECISION WHETHER OR NOT TO GO FORWARD OR NOT.

ALRIGHT? AND I KNOW THIS BOARD ENOUGH TO KNOW THAT WE WANT AS MUCH INPUT AS WE POSSIBLY GET FROM YOU.

THIS IS NOT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, OKAY? WE'RE EITHER ON THE LEFT OR THE RIGHT, UH, BUT THIS IS YORK COUNTY, THIS IS YORKTOWN, THIS IS ONE HELL OF A COMMUNITY TO LIVE IN.

I THINK WE ALL AGREE WITH THAT, BUT GET INVOLVED.

ARTICULATE TO YOUR REPRESENTATIVE IN PARTICULAR, WHERE DO YOU STAND ON THE ISSUE? UH, WHETHER IT'S THE, THE, UH, FACILITY FOR THE INDIVIDUAL WHO'S GONNA CONTROL THINGS DOWN TO THE WATERFRONT, UH, WHETHER OR NOT WE AGREE TO BRING, LET THAT PRINCESS, AND THIS SHOULD COME INTO YORKTOWN, BUT WE WANT TO HEAR YOUR VOICE ON THAT.

DON'T, WE DON'T NEED A BUNCH OF HYSTERIA.

LIKE, WE READ IN THE PAPERS EVERY DAY AND LIKE WE SEE ON TELEVISION EVERY DAY.

BUT AGAIN, AND, AND THIS GROUP OF PEOPLE HERE, NO DOUBT WILL BE VOCAL.

GET YOUR FRIENDS, GET YOUR FAMILY MEMBERS TO ARTICULATE ALSO THEIR POSITION ON WHETHER IT'S THE PRINCESS INITIATIVE OR THE CONSTRUCTION GOING ONGOING DOWN THERE TO WATERFRONT.

WE WANNA HEAR FROM YOU.

UM, NEIL, ONE OF THE THINGS, AND, AND I JUST HEARD, UH, WALT SAY IT THE SAME THING TOO, UM, REFERENCE THE CRUISE SHIP.

WHAT AUTHORITY DO WE HAVE AS SUPERVISORS REFERENCE THAT AT, UH, UH, WHETHER IT COMES HERE OR NOT? UM, I BELIEVE JUST WITH THE CURRENT SORT OF PILOT, YOU KNOW, SITUATION THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT, UH, THE ONLY THING THAT THE COUNTY HAS DIRECT CONTROL OVER WOULD BE THE PEERS, OUR DOCS.

NOW, I SUPPOSE THEY MIGHT BE ABLE TO COME UP WITH SOME OTHER SCENARIO, BUT OBVIOUSLY OUR DOCS ARE THE BEST EQUIPPED AND WOULD BE THE MOST EFFICIENT WAY TO DO THAT.

SO, UM, I GUESS IF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS DIRECTED THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR TO NOT ALLOW THEM TO LAND AT OUR DOCKS, YOU COULD DO THAT.

AND OTHER THAN THAT, THERE'S NO SITE PLAN, THERE'S NO ARCHITECTURE, THERE'S NO NEPO REVIEW, THERE'S, THERE'S NOTHING LIKE THAT.

SO LET ME, UH, JUST UNDERSCORE SOMETHING THOUGH.

YOU REFERENCED THE FACT THAT IT'S OUR DOCKS.

UM, I DON'T KNOW THE CONDITION OF THE, UH, THE WATERMAN'S MUSEUM DOCK.

THE ORIGINAL, THE ORIGINAL PLAN THAT I WAS TOLD IS THAT IT WAS NOT TO COME TO OUR DOCKS.

IN FACT, WHEN, UH, WHEN STEVE AND I VISITED THE SHIP, THEY BRIEFED US IN THE FACT THAT IT WAS NOT COMING TO THE YORK COUNTY DOCKS.

IT WOULD GO INTO THE WATERMAN'S DOCKS.

SO WHEN I TALKED TO, UM, OUR ATTORNEY, MR. HILL, HIS, HIS THOUGHT WAS TOO, THAT IF WE, YOU KNOW, IF FOR SOME REASON THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS STOP THE, UH, TENDERS FROM COMING TO, UH, THE DOCKS, THE GROUNDS WOULD BE SUCH THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO, MAY HAVE TO STOP ALL BOATS USING OUR DOCKS.

AND I MEAN, THAT'S IS HOW IT CAME ACROSS, BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO HAVE A GOOD, I MEAN, I COULD SEE IF YOU HAVE THIS BIG, UH, SHIP PULLING, TRYING TO PULL UP TO OUR DOCKS HERE, THAT WOULD BE, THAT WOULD BE ANOTHER ISSUE.

BUT THIS, THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT A TENDER, RIGHT? OKAY.

WITH THE SHIP BEING A MILE AND A HALF AWAY.

SO I, I GET EMAILS FROM FOLKS TALKING ABOUT, WELL, YOUR BOARD OF SUPERVISORS GOTTA STOP THIS, THE AUTHORITY, WE HAVE NO, UM, ADMINISTRATIVE, NO SUPERVISORY, NO JURISDICTIONAL AUTHORITY OVER WHETHER THE SHIP ACTUALLY COMES INTO THE RIVER WHEREVER IT WANTS TO DOCK.

AND IT COULD OFFLOAD IF IT'S OFFLOAD ON ANOTHER PIECE OF PROPERTY INSTEAD OF OURS.

AND SO, AGAIN, I, IT'S INTERESTING YOU FEEL, I FEEL A BIT OF THE FRUSTRATION AND TRYING TO TALK TO HIM, BUT I KEEP GETTING THESE INPUTS ABOUT, WELL, YOU GOTTA DO SOMETHING, STOP IT.

WELL, LIKE THERE WE ARE, THERE'S A STATE AND THERE'S A FEDERAL LAWS THAT, THAT DICTATE WHAT HAPPENS HERE.

AND SO THEN OUR CONCERN WOULD BE WHETHER THIS POOR SUPERVISORS WOULD ACTUALLY, UH, PROHIBIT THE DOCKING OF A TENDER, WHICH IS JUST A, MAYBE A LITTLE BIT BIGGER, OR IN FACT, IT'S WAY SMALLER THAN THE AMERICAN CRUISE SHIPS THAT COME IN HERE, THAT DOCK AT THE DOCK.

SO PRETTY HARD TO EXPLAIN WHY.

THIS BECAUSE THEY HAVE MOST OF THE PROPERTY, BASICALLY.

AND IT WOULD BE JUSTIFICATION.

SO I DON'T, I KNOW THERE'S A PROBLEM, YOU KNOW, WITH THIS ARGUMENT.

THE SECOND PART, UM, SO ANYWAY, THAT'S THE CRUISE SHIP.

YOU ANSWERED MY QUESTION.

UM, NOW AS PART OF THE, UH, THE MODIFICATIONS TO THE, THE, THE RIVERFRONT PROPERTY THAT WE OWN AND THEY, THAT WE INFLUENCE, WE KNOW THAT WE HAVE THE, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT'S A BIG PLAYER IN

[00:30:01]

AND WE HAVE A LITTLE, VERY LITTLE BIT.

AND THEN IT'S PRIVATELY OWNED AS YOU ALREADY BRIEFED.

TONIGHT THOUGH, WE HAVE ON THE AGENDA THE, THE ISSUE OF THE BUILDING OF THE DOCK MASTER'S OFFICE.

, RIGHT? YES.

SO WHAT THEY SAY TO US TONIGHT, IS IT MM-HMM.

THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING.

THAT'S WHAT WE'RE VOTING ON TONIGHT.

THAT'S CORRECT.

THAT'S RIGHT.

SO THAT WILL HAPPEN TONIGHT.

UH, NOW I DIDN'T, I'M TRYING TO RECALL.

THERE WAS, UH, I DO THIS FROM MY OWN MEMORY, BUT I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANYTHING, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ADJUSTING THE STREETS TONIGHT OR ANYTHING, ARE WE? NO, I MEAN, THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS THE BUILDING WAS DESIGNED THE WAY IT WAS.

RIGHT? OKAY.

TO, WE DIDN'T WANNA ENCROACH IN THE BEACH.

WE DIDN'T WANT ENCROACH IN THE SIDEWALK.

WE DIDN'T WANT TO TRIGGER A, A NEPO REVIEW.

SO THOSE WERE THE CONSTRAINTS THAT THE ARCHITECTS AND ENGINEERS WERE WORKING UNDER.

HOW DO YOU, HOW DO YOU PACKAGE THE THINGS THAT THIS BUILDING NEEDS TO HAVE AND NOT RUN AFOUL OF ALL THOSE OTHER THINGS.

I WAS GONNA MAKE SURE I DIDN'T MISS SOMETHING IN THE PACKAGE HERE.

SO, UM, WELL, TOM, IF I COULD JUST CLARIFY SOMETHING.

SURE.

UM, WITH RESPECT TO THE CONSTRUCTION OF THIS DOCUMENT BUILDING DOWN THERE.

THE REAL QUESTION IS, HMM.

IS THAT DICTATING THAT IT'S A FATE TO COME PLEA THAT WE'RE GONNA IMPROVE, YOU KNOW, TO THE EXTENT WE HAVE AUTHORITY, WE'RE GONNA APPROVE PRINCESS LINE, BRINGING A SHIP, OR DOES IT NOT SAY ANYTHING ABOUT THAT? BECAUSE THERE'S GENERAL NEED TO UPGRADE.

IF YOU'VE, IF YOU'VE BEEN DOWN TO THE WATERSIDE LATELY, UH, THAT, THAT SO-CALLED BUILDING DOCK MEASURES BUILDING, REGARDLESS OF WHAT WE INTEND TO DO DOWN, IT SEEMS TO ME, UH, THERE'S A BETTER, BETTER FACILITY IN THE ONE, IN THE, IN THE DRAWING BOARD RIGHT NOW.

MIGHT BE THAT, BUT IT DOESN'T MEAN WE'RE, WE'RE GONNA HELLBENT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PRINCESS CRUISE LINE COMES IN HERE.

CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, IT'S GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH THAT.

WE'VE BEEN PLANNING THIS SINCE 2017.

RIGHT.

SO, YEAH.

SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE GET SOME CLARIFICATION SO FOLKS WILL KNOW WHAT THEY'RE, WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT TO, I'M SURE THEY ALREADY KNOW, BUT I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE IT WAS CLARIFI TO EVERYBODY.

UM, SO ANOTHER FURTHER, ANOTHER FURTHER QUESTIONS.

WE'LL GO INTO THE COUNTY, COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR'S REPORTS AND, UM, WELL, EXCUSE ME, WE'LL GO TO THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S REPORTS.

SO A CALL ON SHERRY CONSTANTINO, CITIZEN SERVES, AND MADAM, NOTHING TO REPORT THIS EVENING.

VERY GOOD.

COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR'S REPORTS.

I GOT NOTHING ELSE.

I THINK YOU SKIPPED CITIZEN COMMENTS, CITIZEN COMMENTS? NO.

I WAS GONNA GET THAT AFTER ALL THAT.

ALL RIGHT,

[CITIZENS' COMMENT PERIOD]

GOOD.

OKAY, NOW WE'RE GONNA HAVE CITIZEN COMMENTS.

I HAVE, OH, A FEW PEOPLE SIGNED UP HERE.

SORRY.

SO I'LL, OKAY.

HERE'S THE, HERE'S THE DEAL.

WE'RE GONNA CALL, I'M GONNA CALL YOU IN THE ORDER IN WHICH I RECEIVE THE COMMENTS.

UM, THESE ALL APPEAR TO BE IN THE CITIZEN COMMENT PERIOD.

AND, UM, YOU'LL COME FORWARD.

STATE YOUR NAME, YOU GOT THREE MINUTES.

UH, WE'LL HAVE THE LIGHTS ON THERE WHEN THE YELLOW LIGHT OR ORANGE LIGHT, WHATEVER ITS COLOR IS COMES ON, THAT GIVES YOU 20, UH, 32ND WARNING.

AND, UH, OKAY.

SO WE'LL START WITH BILL COLE.

GOOD EVENING.

I'M BILL COLE.

I LIVE AT 2 0 9 AMBLER STREET FOR 26 YEARS AND SIX YEARS AS DIRECTOR OF THE WATERMAN'S MUSEUM.

PRIOR TO THAT, UH, I AM, UH, SPEAKING, UH, UH, OPPOSING THE, UH, OPERATION OF THE PRINCES CRUISES.

AND I APPRECIATE ALL THE THOUGHTFUL COMMENTS THAT YOU'VE MADE ALREADY BECAUSE, UH, YOU HAVE PRETTY MUCH COVERED A LOT OF THE THINGS I'VE, UH, UH, PLANNED TO SAY, BUT I HOPE I WILL SAY THEM IN SOMEWHAT A MORE, UH, LIGHT, UH, FASHION.

WE HAVE A TOWN THAT'S QUITE RENOWNED AND WE ALL LIKE TO SHARE IT.

OUR STREETS ARE NARROW, NO SIDEWALKS, BUT WE JUST GRIN AND BEAR IT.

WE LOVE OUR GUESTS OF EVERY TYPE.

WE MAKE THEM HAPPY TOO, BUT OUR TOWN OF SUCH RE RENOWNED CAN HANDLE.

BUT, BUT A FEW, OUR RESTROOMS, SMALL, CAN'T COMFORT.

ALL OUR RESTAURANTS HAVE NO SPACE, AND WHEN IT RAINS, IT POURS.

BUT NO SHELTERS ARE IN PLACE AND BUSES SPEWING SMOKE AND GRIND.

NOT NOW AND THEN, BUT ALL THE TIME.

WE SHUN THE SIZE OF MONSTER SHIPS AND TOXIC FUMES THAT BURN OUR LIPS, OUR RIVERS, PRECIOUS AND BELOVED.

OIL AND TRASH ARE STRESSY COLEMAN BRIDGE.

SO CLOSE TO US, ERRANT SHIP.

HOW MESSY.

WHO THOUGHT THIS WAS A GOOD IDEA? SAID SOUPS AND STAFF.

NOT ME.

ONLY PRINCESS KNOWS THE SCORE, SO DON'T ASK US, YOU'LL SEE.

SO FRIENDS OF YORK, OUR NEED IS CLEAR.

COME RESCUE US AND CALM

[00:35:01]

OUR FEAR.

SAY NO TO PRINCESS CRUISES, PLEASE, AND SEND HER BACK INTO THE CS.

I THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

THANK YOU, MR. OKAY, JOHN, UH, IS SCHUSTER VET RETIRED? DID I GET THAT RIGHT, MR. OKAY.

I'M JOHN SCHUSTER, AND I LIVE UP AT, UP BY THE COAST GUARD, AND, UH, I'M A VETERAN 21 YEARS.

AND, UH, FIRST THEY'VE TAKEN AWAY OUR CONFEDERATE MONUMENTS.

NOW THEY'RE GONNA BE TAKING AWAY OUR HISTORICAL LAND HERE.

ALSO, I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHO'S GONNA BE PAYING FOR THE, UH, PEOPLE THAT LOSES THEIR FISHING FOR THE CRABS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, AND THE MONEY FOR THE PUB.

IS IT GOING TO JUST BE PROMISED OR IS IT GONNA BE A WRITTEN AGREEMENT? OH, AND WHAT ABOUT THE VENDORS ON SATURDAY? NOTHING WAS MENTIONED ABOUT THAT.

IS IT GONNA BE TORE UP? WE'RE GONNA BE ABLE HAVE VENDORS THERE ON SATURDAY MORNINGS OR NOT? IS THAT A YES? THAT'S A YES.

FOR ME.

THAT'S ABOUT IT.

THANK YOU, SIR, FOR YOUR SERVICE.

WE APPRECIATE IT, AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS.

OKAY, BARBARA LUCK.

BARBARA LUCK.

1 39 SMITH STREET.

JOHN PAGET DIDN'T GIVE US THE WHOLE STORY.

YESTERDAY IN DECEMBER, 2016, PRINCESS WAS ORDERED TO PAY THE LARGEST EVER CRIMINAL PENALTY FOR A, A CRUISE LINE'S ENVIRONMENTAL POLLUTION OF THE SEAS, 40 MILLION.

THE SIZE OF THE FINE WAS BASED NOT ONLY ON THE EXTENT OF PRINCESS'S POLLUTING, BUT ALSO ON THE DELIBERATENESS OF IT AND ON ITS INTENTIONAL COVERUP.

THIS WASN'T MENTIONED YESTERDAY, NOR WAS THE FACT THAT PRINCESS HAD THEN BEEN MAKING ILLEGAL POLLUTING DISCHARGES SINCE 2 0 0 5, 11 YEARS.

FRIGHTENINGLY THIS THREAT TO THE ENVIRONMENT MIGHT HAVE GONE ON INDEFINITELY EXCEPT FOR THE ACT OF A SINGLE WHISTLEBLOWER WHO CAME FORWARD.

PRINCESS'S ACTIONS WERE HARDLY A ONE-OFF OF A FEW BAD ACTORS.

THEY WERE THE OUTCOME OF A CORPORATE CULTURE THAT VALUES PROFIT OVER ENVIRONMENT.

YOU THINK THIS WAS LONG AGO AND THAT PRINCESS HAS SINCE REFORMED ITS ACT? NO.

IN JUNE, 2019, PRINCESS WAS ORDERED TO PAY AN ADDITIONAL 20 MILLION AFTER ADMITTING TO VIOLATIONS OF PROBATION.

THESE MORE RECENT ACTIONS WERE NOT ATTRIBUTABLE TO LOW A LOWLY EMPLOYEE IN THE ENGINE ROOM, BUT THE SENIOR MANAGEMENT.

AND YET IT CONTINUED.

IN JANUARY, 2022, PRINCESS PLEADED GUILTY TO A SECOND REVOCATION OF ITS PROBATION AND WAS ORDERED TO PAY AN ADDITIONAL 1 MILLION.

CAN WE REALLY BELIEVE PRINCESS'S CLAIMS ABOUT ITS ENVIRONMENTAL STEWARDSHIP? NOW, THE SHIPPING INDUSTRY IS SUPERVISED BY THE INTERNATIONAL MARITIME ORGANIZATION, WHICH IS IN FACT RUN BY MOGULS OF THE SHIPPING INDUSTRY.

IN OTHER WORDS, IT'S A FOX GUARDING THE HEN HOUSE SITUATION, AND THE IMOS SELF-POLICING AMOUNTS TO NON POLICING.

THUS, THE BAR FOR ENVIRONMENTAL COMPLIANCE IS VERY LOW BECAUSE ENVIRONMENTAL RESPONSIBILITY CAN BE EXPENSIVE.

SO EVEN IF PRINCESS HAS IMPROVED ITS ACT AS IT CLAIMS, IT STILL HAS A LONG, LONG WAY TO GO.

HELLO, BOB HUDSON, UM, 2 0 7 NELSON STREET.

OKAY, BOB HUDSON.

[00:40:12]

I'M HERE TO OPPOSE THE DOCK MASTER BUILDING AND THE PRINCESS CRUISE SHIPS.

WHAT I FIND PARTICULARLY DISTURBING IS THAT THE COUNTY REFUSED TO ANSWER SPECIFIC QUESTIONS ABOUT THE PURPOSE OF THE DOCK MASTER BUILDING REQUIRING SUCH A LARGE FOOTPRINT IN NON-CONFORMING STYLE.

WE COULD NOT GET A STRAIGHT ANSWER ABOUT THE BUILDING BEING PAID FOR, BUT WITH OUR TAX DOLLARS.

IS THIS JUST A COINCIDENCE? AND THIS IS NOT THE ONLY CASE WHERE THE COUNTY REFUSED TO MAKE CHANGES TO BE COMPLIANT WITH THE H Y D C.

IT HAPPENED WITH THE RIVERWALK RESTAURANT ALSO.

AND SPEAKING OF RIVER WALK, WHY WOULD A RESTAURANT THAT OFTEN SITS UNDERUTILIZED BE EXPANDED TO THE COST OF MILLIONS IN THE FIRST PLACE? COINCIDENCE, COULD IT BE THAT THERE ARE PLANS TO MAKE YORKTOWN AN INTERNATIONAL PORT OF CALL FOR PRINCESS CRUISES? NO, THAT CAN'T BE SOMETHING THAT IMPORTANT WOULD SURELY BE IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

WELL, THE PLANNING COMMISSION ACTUALLY DECIDED NOT TO DISCUSS IT IN THE PLAN.

COINCIDENCE LETTERS AND EMAILS FROM THE COUNTY SHOW THAT MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD SENT A LETTER REQUESTING HELP GETTING STATE FUNDS FOR APPEAR AT THE WATERMAN'S MUSEUM TO SUPPORT THE CREWS.

THIS REQUEST PARROTS A CONFIDENTIAL REQUEST OF THE, OF THE COUNT SENT TO THE COUNTY FROM THE PRESIDENT OF PRINCESS CRUISES.

IT IS ALSO CLEAR THAT PRINCESS CRUISE CRUISE LINES WANTS TO EXPAND WELL BEYOND THE PILOT TO WEEKLY SEASONAL CRUISES.

THAT WAS IN EMAILS ALSO.

SINCE WHEN DO BOARD MEMBERS ACT AT ON CONFIDENTIAL REQUESTS FROM CORPORATE ENTITIES? WHERE'S THE TRANSPARENCY COINCIDENCE? LAST MONTH'S BEATING AT LAST MONTH'S BOARD MEETING, CITIZENS LEFT WERE LEFT WITH THE IMPRESSION THAT PRINCESS CRUISES WAS NEWS TO THE BOARD AND SOMETHING TO BE LOOKED INTO.

BUT THAT DOESN'T SEEM TO BE THE CASE.

THE LARGE DOCK MASTER BUILDING IS TO MANAGE BOATS BEING TENDERED TO THE COUNTY'S PIER FOR THE PRINCESS PILOT PROGRAM.

IF THIS NEWS IS, IF THIS IS NEWS TO THE BOARD, THEY SHOULD BE OUTRAGED THAT YORKTOWN IS BEING MADE A PORT OF WITHOUT THEIR INPUT AND VOTE DOWN THIS PROPOSED DOC MASTER BUILDING.

IF THEY KNEW ALL ALONG AND WERE MAKING THESE DECISIONS, WERE PART OF MAKING THESE DECISIONS, UM, UH, WITHOUT CITIZEN INPUT, THEY'LL VOTE FOR IT.

THERE IS AN ONLINE PETITION CALLED STOP PRINCESS CRUISES WITH OVER 1500 SIGNATURES.

CITIZENS ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE CHARACTER ALTERING IMPACT THESE MASSIVE CRUISE SHIPS HAVE HAD ON OTHER DESTINATIONS.

WATER, AIR, AND NOISE POLLUTION.

PRINCESS CRUISE LINES WAS TWICE CONVICTED THREE TIMES.

I JUST HEARD.

SIR, CAN YOU, CAN YOU STEP FORWARD TO THE MIC? YOU'RE YOU'RE COMING KIND OF MUFFLED HERE.

BY THE WAY, YORK COUNTY IS THE LOWEST RATE OF OFFICERS TO RESIDENCE ON THE PENINSULA.

PRINCESS CRUISE LINE, THEIR CURRENT SCORES FOR SEWAGE TREATMENT, WATER COMPLIANCE AND TRANSPARENCY ARE D PLUS, D MINUS AND F RESPECTIVELY FROM THE FRIENDS OF EARTH.

THIS IS A MUCH DIFFERENT STORY THAN THE ONE TOLD BY PRINCESS AT THE INVITATION ONLY MEETING HELD LAST NIGHT.

HOW COULD HAVE WE GOTTEN TO THIS POINT WITHOUT MAKING A LEGITIMATE EFFORT TO LISTEN TO THE CITIZENS OF YORK COUNTY ON THE SUPPORT AND ISSUE? LASTLY, FOR MONTHS NOW, CITIZENS HAVE ASKED THE BOARD TO SUPPORT A CODE OF ETHICS.

AND FOR MONTHS THE CALLS HAVE BEEN UNANSWERED.

JUST ANOTHER COINCIDENCE, I GUESS.

UH, STEVE KENNEDY, 1 0 4 PENN DRIVE.

I DID A LITTLE CHITCHAT WITH OUR FRIENDS AT THE PLANNING COMMISSION ON AUGUST 9TH.

CHECK OUT THAT FIVE MINUTE CHAT.

UH, THANK YOU FOR THAT TIME.

IN THESE THREE MINUTES, I TITLED THAT THE SYMBOLISM OVER SUBSTANCE, THE S O S DOCUMENT, SLOW THE ROLL ON THE 2040 COMP PLAN, PLEASE.

THIS ARBITRARY DATE OF SEPTEMBER 13TH IS OLD NEWS, INACCURATE DATA.

IMAGINE IF I WAS UNDERWRITING A YORK COUNTY MUNICIPAL BOND AND I WAS GIVING YOU DATA FROM APRIL, 2019.

IMAGINE IF THERE WERE MATERIAL CHANGES IN KEY MANAGEMENT, YOU WOULD HAVE TO RESEND AND REPLAY, UH, UH, REFILE THAT PROSPECTUS BEFORE YOU COULD BRING THAT TO THE PUBLIC.

KEY MANAGEMENT CHANGES HERE.

100% A PUBLIC SERVANT, MR. COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR WON'T BE HERE.

ONE SEVENTH OF YOUR PLANNING COMMISSION NOT GONNA BE HERE IN JANUARY.

40 TO 80% OF YOU WILL NOT BE HERE IN JANUARY.

IMAGINE WHAT THAT'S GONNA LOOK LIKE NEXT.

POLICE LAW ENFORCEMENT MR. SHEPHERD, PUTS OUT THIS BEAUTIFUL DISTRICT FIVE REPORT ABOUT CRIME.

WATCH.

WELL DONE, SIR.

I LEARNED ABOUT SHOTS FIRED IN KILN CREEK.

I LEARNED ABOUT HUMAN TRAFFICKING, ALL KINDS OF AMAZING THING.

YOUR SECTION IN YOUR NEWSLETTER IS LONGER THAN THE DRAFT IN THE COUNT PLANT.

HOW CAN THAT BE? YOU'RE REFERENCING DATA.

GOING BACK TO THE OLD NEWS THEME OF CRIME IN VIRGINIA 2020.

HAS ANYTHING CHANGED POST COVID? HAS ANYTHING HAPPENED IN YORK COUNTY IN LAW ENFORCEMENT SINCE THIS WAS PUT OUT?

[00:45:01]

ONE TO 7 75 WILLIAMSBURG ONE FOR EVERY 386 CITIZENS.

PERHAPS THAT MIGHT BE A GOOD USE OF SOME OF THE GOVERNMENT SURPLUS, THE 10, 11, $12 MILLION SURPLUS.

WE NEED MORE PEOPLE LIKE THE GENTLEMAN IN THE BACK.

BY THE WAY, I THOUGHT THE CHIEF DID NOT MAKE IT TO THE MEETING.

IF MY DATA IS WRONG AND YOUR MINUTES ARE INACCURATE, LET ME KNOW.

IF THE CHIEF DID NOT MAKE IT TO THE MEETING, LET'S GET HIM THERE.

LET'S GET BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD PLEASE.

71,000 PEOPLE NEED HIM AND WE NEED MORE SHERIFFS, ESPECIALLY THOSE OF US IN RURAL LAND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.

2014 REFERENCE PLACEMAKING.

ONE OF MY ALL TIME FAVORITES.

MARCH, 2014.

I WONDER THAT WHERE THAT PHRASE CAME FROM.

IT WAS A, OH, UM, THE, UH, AMERICAN PLANNING ASSOCIATION HAS NOTHING HAPPENED AT THE A P A IN THE LAST NINE YEARS.

CAN WE GET SOMETHING THAT'S MORE RECENT, PLEASE? FINALLY, ONE OF MY FAVORITES.

BROADBAND.

I THOUGHT THIS WAS LAUGHABLE.

UH, ESPECIALLY YOUR VERY LIGHT DATASET.

YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT COX AS IF PEOPLE ARE SATISFIED ON A SCALE OF ONE TO 10, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, COX'S RELIABILITY IS ABOUT A MINUS FOUR.

WITH A TALENT LIKE MR. RONE AND MR. WASMER, WHY CAN'T WE FIND ANY EFFORTS OR SOLUTIONS TO HELP THE 71,000 CITIZENS? MAYBE CALL ELON MUSK.

ELON, IF YOU'RE WATCHING, WE NEED YOU.

MAYBE IT'S IRIDIUM SAT PHONES, DON'T KNOW.

CONSERVE YORK COUNTY.ORG.

CHECK US OUT.

WE'LL HAVE QUESTIONS FOR CANDIDATES UP SHORTLY.

WE'LL SEE YOU FOR DEBATES IN SEPTEMBER AND OCTOBER.

BY THE WAY, COUNSELOR, FOR YOUR, UH, CONTINUING ED, BASIC ECONOMICS NEEDS TO BE A MANDATORY COURSE FOR EVERYBODY WRITING IN THE COMP PLAN.

GOODNIGHT.

ELIZABETH WILKINS, 2 28 CHURCH STREET.

I THINK THIS IS ELIZABETH WILL, WILL WILLIAMS WILKINS WIL.

OKAY, WILKINS.

GOOD EVENING BOARD MEMBERS.

I'D LIKE TO GIVE YOU MY ASSESSMENT OF THE PRINCESS PEP RALLY WE WERE SUBJECTED TO YESTERDAY.

HERE'S HOW IT ALL WENT DOWN.

THIS WAS NOT A PUBLIC FORUM, BUT AN INVITE ONLY PRODUCTION, RECEPTION STYLE WITH REFRESHMENTS, PUB TABLES, ET CETERA.

HELD AT 4:00 PM SO UNAVAILABLE TO MOST WORKING PEOPLE.

THIS LET PRINCESS STACK THE ROOM WITH INVITED SUPPORTERS AND THEN FILL IN WITH SOME OF US, US FOR BALANCE.

A FEW OF THE UNINVITED WERE LET IN THE DOOR, BUT THAT'S NOT THE SAME AS A PUBLIC MEETING HELD IN THE EVENING THAT COULD BE ADVERTISED AS SUCH.

FIRST UP WAS THE INFOMERCIAL, A MOSTLY GENERIC PRINCESS PROMO ABOUT THE ROMANTIC LOVE BOAT LEGACY NARRATED BY LOVE BOAT ACTOR JILL WHEELAN, HERSELF, C E O JOHN PAGET THEN MOVED ON TO WHY PRINCESS IS PERFECT FOR YORKTOWN AND BREALY ASSURED US THAT HE WOULD BE TAKING PRINCESS IN A NEW SUSTAINABLE DIRECTION.

GLOSSING OVER THE CRIMINAL ENVIRONMENTAL RECORD THAT HAS DOGGED PRINCESS FOR A COUPLE OF DECADES.

ALSO FEATURED WAS JEFF CORWIN TV PERSONALITY, NOW BIOLOGIST FOR HIRE TO TRUMPET THE EXCITING NEW SUSTAINABILITY FEATURES OF PRINCESS LINES.

I'LL DISCUSS JUST ONE OF THOSE, ALTHOUGH I COULD GO ON AND ON AND I HOPE I GET THE CHANCE.

THESE CRUISE SHIPS USE A DIRTY GRADE OF OIL CALLED BUNKER OIL OR HEAVY FUEL OIL, OR HFOS, WHICH IS A TAR SLUDGE LEFTOVER FROM THE CR CRUDE OIL REFINING PROCESS.

A MISSION OF TOXIC NITROGEN OXIDES AND SULFUR OXIDES FROM THE BURNING OF HFOS IS AN ONGOING SERIOUS THREAT TO GLOBAL HUMAN EN ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH.

HE MENTIONED THE FANCY SCRUBBERS THAT SUPPOSEDLY SAVE US FROM THOSE HARMS. WELL, ACTUALLY, THE USE OF THESE SCRUBBERS IS NOW BANNED IN MANY PORTS AROUND THE WORLD, INCLUDING THE STATE OF CONNECTICUT, CALIFORNIA WATERS, AND THE PORT OF SEATTLE.

THE PROBLEM IS THAT THEY TRANSFORM AN AIR POLLUTION PROBLEM INTO A WATER POLLUTION PROBLEM.

AS THE WASH WATER IS DISCHARGED ON SITE, THEY ALSO DO NOTHING TO REDUCE EMISSIONS OF GREENHOUSE GASES SUCH AS C O TWO PRINCESS COULD USE A LIGHTER CLEANER FUEL OIL, BUT SO FAR HAVE NOT MADE THAT CHOICE.

LIKE I SAID, I COULD GO ON, BUT BACK TO THE MEETING, WHEN THE FORMAL SHOW ENDED, WE WERE ENCOURAGED TO VISIT THE PRINCESS REPS LOBBYISTS AND YORK COUNTY STAFF IN THE FOUR CORNERS OF THE ROOM TO ASK ALL OF OUR QUESTIONS.

SOUNDS GOOD, RIGHT? BUT HERE'S THE PROBLEM.

THE MANY TOUGH QUESTIONS, ALONG WITH RESPONSES THAT I HEARD THROUGHOUT THE ROOM WILL NOT BE HEARD BY THE PUBLIC, NOR WERE THEY RECORDED, NOR WERE THEY AVAILABLE TO THE PRESS.

[00:50:01]

SHAME ON PRINCESS AND YOUR COUNTY FOR ALLOWING THIS SHAM TO OCCUR.

WE REQUEST A DO-OVER.

THANK YOU, MA'AM.

IS THIS JOSE LONGORIA? DID I SAY THAT RIGHT? YES, IT IS VERY GOOD FOR PRONOUNCING IT.

GOOD EVENING BOARD.

IT'S, UH, IT IS A PLEASURE TO BE HERE AND THANK YOU FOR THE THREE, THREE MINUTES.

I'M ECHOING THE SAME AS A LOT OF THE FOLKS IN HERE ARE MENTIONING WITH REGARD TO THE PRINCESS CRUISE LINES.

JUST A ONE CITIZEN NAME AND ADDRESS, PLEASE, SIR, OF IT.

NAME AND ADDRESS.

JOSE LONGORIA.

HAVE TWO PROPERTIES RESIDE AT 1 0 5 KISKI, WATCH, SPEAK TO AND SPEAKING TO THE MIC.

ABSOLUTELY.

AND AS I MENTIONED BEFORE, THANKS FOR THE TIME.

I'M ECHOING THE SAME SENTIMENTS AS SOME OF THE OTHER CITIZENS HAVE SAID AND ARE SAYING TONIGHT.

I'M JUST ONE MORE VOICE AMONGST, UH, THAT CITIZENRY.

I'M ALSO SAYING THAT, UM, WE'RE NOT AGAINST, WE'RE NOT SAYING IT'S NOT GREAT TO HAVE PEOPLE COME TO YORKTOWN AND LEARN ABOUT THE HISTORY.

IT'S A BEAUTIFUL PLACE TO LIVE, TO BE, AND IT'S VERY WELCOMING.

HOWEVER, IT IS THAT CRUISE SHIP.

ENVISION THAT CRUISE SHIP OUT THERE HOWEVER MANY TIMES IT'LL COME.

THREE IS PILOT FIVE, WHO KNOWS, MAYBE DOWN THE ROAD EVEN MORE, WHO KNOWS? BUT IT IS JUST A MONSTER, MASSIVE VESSEL THAT'S GONNA BE OUT THERE IN THIS QUAINT LOOKING LITTLE VILLAGE THAT WE'VE ALL COME TO LOVE AND JUST ENJOY.

AND I THINK IT'S GONNA TAKE AWAY A LOT OF THAT, UM, GOODNESS FROM THIS VILLAGE.

I, I'M ALSO, OR WAS PART OF THE HISTORIC YORKTOWN DESIGN COMMITTEE, SO I'M VERY FAMILIAR WITH SOME OF THE DRAWINGS THAT, UH, MR. MORGAN HAS MENTIONED THERE.

I WOULD ENCOURAGE THE BOARD TO PLEASE KEEP YOUR THUMB ON THE PUB AND PLEASE IF ONE 10TH COME DOWN, BRING THEM BOTH DOWN AND MAKE 'EM COME TO THE TABLE WITH A PRESENTABLE SOLUTION.

THAT IS A GREAT DESIGN FOR YORKTOWN AND NOT JUST FOR THE CITIZENS, BUT FOR THE VISITORS THAT'LL COME IN LINE WITH WHATEVER FUTURE PLANS WE HAVE TO, UM, MAKE THE WATERFRONT MORE ENJOYABLE FOR EVERYBODY.

I'M ALSO HERE TO JUST, MY LAST THING THAT I WANT TO SAY, AND BOB KIND OF MENTIONED IT TOO, I'VE KIND OF LOOKED FOR A CODE OF ETHICS, UH, FOR YORKTOWN AND OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS.

GOD BLESS YOU GUYS, YOU GUYS HAVE A TOUGH JOB.

BUT BY THE SAME TOKEN, IT SEEMS LIKE WE'RE MISSING THAT ONE KEY COMPONENT PART.

AND I WISH YOU GUYS WOULD, EITHER ONE OF YOU GUYS WOULD, JUST ONE OF YOU WONDERFUL PEOPLE, STAND UP AND SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT? LET'S JUST JUST HAVE A CODE OF ETHICS THAT WE CAN AT LEAST GO BACK TO.

WE SAY THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG WHEN WE OPEN THESE MEETINGS, BUT BY THE SAME TOKEN, IT'S THAT LITTLE FOUNDATIONAL CODE OF ETHICS THAT'LL KEEP US VECTORED IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION, RESPONSIBLE PUBLIC ELECTED OFFICIALS.

WE NEED THAT FOR YOUR COUNTY AND I'LL LEAVE YOU WITH THAT.

THANK YOU, SIR.

HOPE I DON'T BUTCHER THIS ONE.

DALILA JOHNSON, I GET IT RIGHT PERFECTLY.

AND PUBLIC FORUMS CONDUCTED? IF THERE'S NOTHING WRONG, WE NEED A CODE OF ETHICS THAT PROVIDES THE CITIZEN OF YOUR COUNTY TRANSPARENCY AND ACCOUNTABILITY.

DID SOMETHING TONIGHT.

THANK YOU MR. SHEPHERD.

UH, ALILA JOHNSON, UH, SHERWOOD TRACE, UM, YOUR TOWN.

GOOD EVENING, MEMBERS OF THE BOARD AND THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING ME TO SPEAK YOU TO YOU TONIGHT.

ON BEHALF OF THE CITIZENS FOR THE CODE OF ETHICS.

ETHICS IS DEFINED AS THE MORAL PRINCIPLE THAT GOVERNS A PERSON'S BEHAVIOR OR A CONDUCTING OF AN ACTIVITY.

AND UNLIKE JAMES CITY, COUNTY, AND MANY OTHER BORDERING COUNTIES, OUR CURRENT YORK COUNTY BOARD OF SUPERVISOR DOES NOT HAVE A CODE OF ETHICS.

MANY ON THIS BOARD MAY FEEL THAT IT IS NOT NECESSARY.

I WOULD LIKE TO PROVIDE AN EXAMPLE OR A FACT WHY YOUR, YOUR COUNTY SHOULD CREATE AND EMBRACE A CODE OF ETHICS IN THE INTEREST OF BREVITY.

I WILL BEGIN WITH THE FOLLOWING.

A CODE OF ETHICS ENCOURAGES NON-PARTISAN COHESION INCLUSIVITY RATHER THAN DIVISION IN LOCAL COMMUNITIES AT A TIME WHEN PARTISAN POLITICS SO OFTEN DRIVES PUBLIC CONVERSATION.

IN OTHER WORDS, TRANSPARENCY AND ACCOUNTABILITY.

HERE ARE THE FACTS.

IN JANUARY OF THIS YEAR, SOME MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD WERE NOTIFIED AND MADE AWARE OF THE PRINCESS CRUISE INTENTION AND ULTIMATE ARRIVAL TO OUR HISTORICAL AND WELL PRESERVE YOUR TOWN BEACH, THEIR MASSIVE 950 FOOT POLLUTION MACHINE WITH HIS 2,200 TO 3000 PASSENGERS LANDING IN OUR SMALL BEACH IN BATCHES OF 100 AT A TIME.

WE ARE TOLD TO BELIEVE THAT SOME WILL BE BUZZED TO OTHER SURROUNDING AREAS.

SOME WILL BE TOURING OUR BEAUTIFUL HISTORIC YORKTOWN BEACH WHILE CONTRIBUTING TO OUR ECONOMY.

WHY WAS THE INFORMATION NOT DISCLOSED AT ONCE

[00:55:01]

THE TRUTH IS PRINCESS CRUZ, ACCORDING TO THE US JUSTICE DEPARTMENT, WAS INVOLVED IN DELIBERATIVE VESSEL POLLUTION IN 2019 AND 2022.

AND SOME OTHER TIME, I CAN'T REMEMBER NOW.

OUR COMMUNITY HAS WORKED REALLY HARD.

YOU ALL HAVE WORKED VERY HARD TO KEEP OUR WATERWAYS CLEAN AND YOUR COUNTY, YOU ALL HAVE WORKED VERY HARD.

MR. NEIL HAVE WORKED REALLY HARD TO INVEST IN THE CHESAPEAKE BAY AND TO SEE ALL WASH AWAY BY SOME CHANCE AT TOURISM PENNIES WE CAN DO BETTER, SHOULD DO BETTER.

OUR FUTURE DEPENDS ON IT.

I UNDERSTAND THAT YOUR COUNTY HAS NO REGULATORY AUTHORITY OVER THE SHIP'S VISIT.

HOWEVER, YOUR COUNTY DOES HAVE A SAY SO AND WHO CAN AND CANNOT DOCK THE PI.

THERE HAS TO BE A BALANCE.

WE MUST FIND IT AS THIS WORD TO EVALUATE THE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT IN OUR WATER, LAND, AND AIR, AND TO LISTEN TO HIS CITIZENS.

THANK YOU MA'AM.

OKAY, LARRY ELL, GOOD EVENING.

LARRY RAYLE 1 1 4 CHURCH STREET RIGHT ACROSS FROM GRACE CHURCH OVER HERE.

THANK YOU FOR THE TIME ADDRESS YOU AGAIN.

UM, I SPOKE AT THE 18TH JULY, UH, MEETING.

UH, WE ONLY HAD THREE OF YOU HERE.

I'M GONNA ADDRESS THE SAME ISSUE THAT I SPOKE TO THEN AND THAT'S TRANSPARENCY AND OPENNESS AND HONESTY AND INTEGRITY BY THE BOARD.

AND I WOULD ALSO LIKE TO EMPHASIZE TO YOU ALL THAT YOU ARE IN FACT THE KEY ORGANIZATION THAT HOLDS THE HISTORY OF THIS PLACE IN YOUR HANDS.

YES, THERE'S THE PARK SERVICE MAYBE, BUT YOU ALL ARE THE ONES THAT OWN THE WATERFRONT AND SOME OF THE PROPERTIES, WHICH ARE THE I, THE THINGS THAT ARE BEING CHANGED.

I WAS IN EDENTON, NORTH CAROLINA THREE WEEKS AGO.

I DUNNO IF YOU'VE BEEN THERE.

IT IS A WONDERFUL, EXTREMELY HISTORIC SMALL TOWN.

I TALKED TO SEVERAL PEOPLE, ONE ON THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND THEY RUN AN ENTIRE TOWN, HOSPITALS, EVERYTHING ELSE, MODERN TOWN.

BUT THEIR HISTORY IS THE PRIORITY.

YOU ALL NEED TO PAY MORE ATTENTION, IN MY OPINION, TO THE HISTORY OF THIS PLACE.

AND THAT WATERFRONT IS PART OF THE HISTORY.

MR. PAGET MAY SAY HE KNOWS THE VILLAGE OR, OR NEIL.

YOU MENTIONED MR. MORGAN THAT HE KNOWS IT.

I'M GONNA TELL YOU, HE DOESN'T.

HE KNOWS THE RIVER.

HE LIVED HERE WHEN HE WAS YOUNGER, BUT HE DOES NOT KNOW THE VILLAGE NOW.

HE HASN'T TALKED TO US.

NONE OF US PEOPLE HAVE.

WHEN YOU ARE WALKING, LOOKING AT THAT WATERFRONT, TALKING ABOUT THE PUB, YES, THOSE OF US IN THE VILLAGE WOULD LIKE TO SEE IT LOOK NICER DOWN THERE.

BUT WHAT'S HAPPENING IS I SIT AT THE END OF THE ZOOM MEETING, I SEE IT COMING.

THEY'RE GONNA MAKE IT NICER.

OH, SO WE CAN BRING MORE PEOPLE IN.

WE CAN DOUBLE THE SIZE OF THE PUB.

WE CAN HAVE MORE PEOPLE, YOU KNOW.

AND, UM, QUITE FRANKLY, THEY DON'T OFFER ANSWERS TO THE PROBLEMS. PARKING, IT'S TOO MANY PEOPLE AROUND TRASH.

IT'S JUST YOU ALL HAVE GOT TO BE THE ONES THAT MAKE THE HARD DECISIONS.

AND SOMETIMES NO ISN'T A PLEASANT ANSWER.

THE DOCK MASTER BUILDINGS, YES, WE ALL AGREE WE NEED BETTER BATHROOMS. YES, I'M A NAVY GUY.

I'VE BEEN THE PITE.

I THINK THE DOCK MASTER NEEDS A BIGGER B SPACE.

YOU DIDN'T MENTION THE CONFERENCE ROOM, YOU DIDN'T MENTION THE OFFICES, YOU DIDN'T MENTION A STORAGE PLACE ON THE H Y D C.

WE SAID GO BACK AND RE-LOOK THE DESIGN PLEASE.

THAT IS TOO BIG OF A BUILDING.

IT LOOKS MORE LIKE A PENNSYLVANIA DUTCH FARMHOUSE, NOT COLONIAL.

AND BASICALLY A YEAR LATER WITH THE PUBLIC IN THE ROOM, WE WERE TOLD SAY ALL YOU WANT, WE'RE GONNA BUILD WHAT WE WANT.

THAT IS NOT AN APPROPRIATE RESPONSE BY OUR REPRESENTATIVES.

MR. GREEN IS OUR REPRESENTATIVE, BUT THE REST OF YOU ARE THE ONLY ONES THAT CAN CONTROL AND KEEP THIS HISTORY.

SO PLEASE MAKE THE HISTORY THE PRIORITY FOR THIS AREA AND SAY SOMETIMES THE HARD NO ANSWER.

THANKS SIR.

OKAY, THAT'S ALL I HAVE SIGNED UP TO SPEAK.

IS THERE ANYONE ELSE IN HERE HERE TO SPEAK? I TURNED THE PAPER IN BUD.

OKAY, WELL COME FORWARD PLEASE AND STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS.

[01:00:07]

MY NAME IS TERRY HOTSON.

I LIVE AT 2 0 7 NELSON STREET.

I WOULD HAVE MY SHIRT ON, BUT MY HUSBAND DID NOT PUT IT IN THE DRYER, SO I APOLOGIZE FOR THAT.

UM, THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME SPEAK THIS EVENING AND THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE.

IN 2004, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS ESTABLISHED THE YORKTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT AND THE ACCOMPANY HISTORIC YORKTOWN DESIGN GUIDELINES.

THE HISTORIC YORKTOWN DESIGN COMMITTEE, H Y D C IS, UH, WAS TASKED WITH MAKING SURE THESE GUIDELINES WERE FOLLOWED.

HOWEVER, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS HAS BEEN KNOWN TO CONTRADICT THESE GUIDELINES, WHICH THEY THEMSELVES CREATED.

A RECENT EXAMPLE IS THE PROPOSED WATERFRONT DOCK MASTER BUILDING, WHICH BACK IN 2019, YORK COUNTY BROUGHT TO THE H Y D C FOR APPROVAL DUE TO ITS PROPOSED MASSIVE SIZE AND NON-CONFORMING DESIGN.

THE COMMITTEE ASKED THE COUNTY TO PLEASE MAKE SOME MODIFICATIONS IN MAY OF THIS YEAR.

THE COUNTY AGAIN BROUGHT IT BACK TO H Y D C FOR APPROVAL.

NOT ONE CHANGE HAD BEEN MADE TO THE PROPOSED STRUCTURE IN FOUR YEARS TIME.

SO THE COMMITTEE TABLED THEIR DECISION AND AGAIN, ASKED THE COUNTY TO MAKE MODIFICATIONS.

MANY CITIZENS WERE AT THIS MEETING AND THEY VOICED THE SAME CONCERNS ABOUT THE INAPPROPRIATE DESIGN AND THE MASSIVE SIZE THAT WAS OUT OF SCALE WITH THE OTHER BUILDINGS ALONG THE WATERFRONT.

A MONTH LATER, THE COUNTY CAME BACK TO THE TABLE WITH ABSOLUTELY NO CHANGES AND SAID IT WOULD BE IMPRACTICAL TO MAKE THE MODIFICATIONS.

WELL, NOW WE KNOW.

WHY DON'T WE? PUBLIC RECORDS SHOW THAT THE COUNTY HAD ALREADY AWARDED A CONTRACT FOR ENGINEERING SERVICES FOR AMOUNT, JUST BARELY UNDER THE A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS.

AN AMOUNT THAT REQUIRE, THAT WOULD REQUIRE THE BOARD OF SUPERVISOR'S APPROVAL AND THEREFORE PUBLIC INPUT BY EVERY TAXPAYER THAT WOULD PUT THE BILL FOR IT.

IN ADDITION, BIDS HAD ALREADY BEEN REQUESTED FOR THE DEMOLITION AND CONSTRUCTION OF THE DOCK MASTER BUILDING AND THE COUNTY HAS ALREADY AWARDED THE WINNING BID.

SO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS VOTE TONIGHT ON WHETHER TO SUPPORT THE H Y D'S RECOMMENDATION IS SIMPLY A FORMALITY, ISN'T IT? THIS EVIDENTLY HAS BEEN A DONE DEAL FOR A LONG TIME.

THE APPROVAL FOR THE DEMOLITION AND CONSTRUCTION OF THE DOCK MASTER BUILDING DIRECTLY FOLLOWS THE H Y D C APPEAL VOTE TONIGHT.

IT'S BEEN A CONSISTENT THEME THAT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS OVERRIDES THE H Y D C IN APPEAL.

WHY EVEN HAVE AN ARCHITECTURE REVIEW BOARD AND GUIDELINES IF YOU'RE JUST GOING TO DISREGARD THEM WHEN IT SUITS YOU? IN ADDITION, RECENTLY TWO MEMBERS OF THE H Y D C WERE TOLD THEIR SERVICES WERE NO LONGER BE NEEDED BY THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS BECAUSE THEY WERE GOING IN A DIFFERENT DIRECTION.

COULD IT BE THESE TWO MEMBERS HAD BEEN A BIT TOO VOCAL AND EXPRESSING THEIR VIEWS, THAT VIEWS THAT WERE IN KEEPING WITH THE GUIDELINES, BUT UM, NOT WITH WHAT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WANTED.

AND AT INSULT INJURY, ONE OF THE H Y D C REPLACEMENTS IS A COUNTY EMPLOYEE AND THE OTHER IS ON THE BOARD OF THE WATERMAN'S MUSEUM.

HOW CONVENIENT IS THAT IN LIEU OF THE PRINCESS CRUISE LINE FIASCO? SO MUCH FOR TRANSPARENCY, TRUST IN ANY TRUE INPUT BY THE CITIZENS WHO VOTED FOR THE CURRENT BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, I THINK WE DO NEED TO CONSIDER A CODE OF ETHICS.

I'M NOT SAYING THERE'S ANYTHING WRONG WITH WHAT HAPPENED BEFORE, BUT I THINK LIKE OTHER PEOPLE HAVE SAID, WE NEED TO CONSIDER THAT.

AND I DO TAKE OFFENSE WHEN YOU SAY DON'T LISTEN TO THE HYSTERICS.

WE GET HYSTERICAL MAYBE.

WELL, THAT'S, YOU'RE CALLING IT WHEN WE DON'T GET INFORMATION, WE NEED INFORMATION.

THAT'S ALL WE'VE ASKED ALL ALONG AND TO HAVE INPUT.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

OKAY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

SEE ANYONE ELSE CARES.

SPEAK, SEEING NONE.

AND I'LL CLOSE THE, UH, IT SAYS COMMENT PERIOD.

OKAY, LET'S SEE WHAT TIME WE'VE GOT.

IT'S A LITTLE LATE.

I'LL TAKE, UH, WE'RE GONNA TAKE A FIVE MINUTE BREAK.

WE'RE IN RECESS FOR FIVE MINUTES.

WE'RE GONNA START OFF WITH A PUBLIC HEARING.

I CALLED THE MEETING BACK TO ORDER.

UH, TONIGHT

[2 Application No. ZM-197-23 and UP-1015-23, Flipping Flea.]

AND THIS IS A CONS, UH, LET'S SEE.

CONSIDER ADOPTION OF OPPOSED ORDINANCE NUMBER 2311.

IT'S AN APPLICATION.

UM, THERE'S TWO APPLICATIONS HERE.

OH, EXCUSE ME.

NOT TWO APPLICATIONS.

ONE APPLICATIONS IS ZM 1 97 23, AND A RESOLUTION 23 DASH 12.

THE APPLICATION FOR FLEE FLIP, UH, FLIPPING FLEE.

THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE WILL REZONE 1.6 ACRES FROM ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY TO GM.

AND, UH, SUBJECT TO, UH, VOLUNTARY PROFFERS CONDITIONS AND PROPOSED RESOLUTION WILL BE AUTHORIZED WILL TO AUTHORIZE A SPECIAL USE PERMIT FOR THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A STORAGE SHED AND DISPLAY FACILITY, YOUR HONOR.

COFFEE SHOP IN JAMES CITY COUNTY ON RICHMOND ROAD CALLED THE SIPPING FLEE, UH, AS SORT OF AN ACCESSORY BUSINESS TO THAT COFFEE SHOP.

GOOD EVENING, MR. CHAIRMAN.

MEMBERS OF THE BOARD, UM, UH, THE FLIPPING PLEA.

L L C IS THE CORPORATE NAME OF NANCY LEE, WHO IS A YORK COUNTY RESIDENT WHO OWNS AND OPERATES A

[01:05:01]

UH, SHE ALSO UH, IS A LOCAL DEALER FOR, UM, COMPANY CALLED OLD HICKORY BUILDINGS AND SHEDS.

UH, THEY MANUFACTURE, UH, HIGH-END, UH, UH, ENGINEER CERTIFIED, UH, SHEDS AND, AND SM AND, UH, UH, PORTABLE BUILDINGS, UH, THAT SORT OF THING.

UH, SHE ALSO, UH, OPERATES, UH, OWNS AND OPERATES TWO FLEA MARKETS OUT OF THAT SAME SHOPPING CENTER, FLIPPING FLEA ONE AND TWO.

THE SHOPPING CENTER IS ON THE MARKET LIKELY TO BE SOLD AND REDEVELOPED.

AND SO, UH, THAT HAS CAUSED HER TO, UH, RELOCATE TO FIND A NEW LOCATION.

UH, I BELIEVE THE FLEA MARKETS, SHE PLANS TO EVENTUALLY SHUT DOWN, BUT SHE WOULD LIKE TO MOVE THE COFFEE SHOP AND THE STORAGE SHED BU, UH, BUSINESS TO YORK COUNTY.

AND THE, UH, ON SPOT PROPERTY IN QUESTION, UH, 1.6 ACRES, UH, LOCATED IN A LITTLE TRIANGULAR AREA OUTLINED IN BLUE HERE, UM, BOUNDED BY MOTOWN ROAD, OLD MOTOWN ROAD, AND, UH, HORNER LANE.

THE, UH, PROPERTY IS ZONED ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY, AS IS ALL THE PROPERTY SURROUNDING IT.

ON THE YORK COUNTY SIDE, UH, ACROSS OLD MOTOWN ROAD, UH, IS JAMES CITY COUNTY.

AND ON THAT SIDE, PROPERTY IS ZONED, UH, R TWO, WHICH IS A GENERAL RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICT.

UH, THE PROPERTY, WHICH CONSISTS OF TWO PARCELS, IS SURROUNDED, UH, ON THE, UH, ON THE, UH, EAST, UH, BY THE FERGUSON SHOWROOM.

AND THEN DIAGONALLY, UH, ACROSS FROM IT IS THE MICHAEL COMMONS OFFICE COMPLEX.

AND ON THE OTHER SIDE OF HORNER LANE IS THE, UH, FUTURE SIDE OF THE, UH, WADA, UH, BUS TRANSFER FACILITY THAT YOU ALL APPROVED A COUPLE YEARS AGO.

AND THEN ON THE JAMES CITY COUNTY SIDE, THERE IS A SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED HOME ON A, ABOUT ABOUT A 0.9 ACRE PARCEL, UH, AN UNDEVELOPED 0.9 ACRE PARCEL.

AND THEN THERE'S A 4.7 ACRE PARCEL WITH A HOUSE ON IT THAT'S, UH, SET BACK, UH, KIND OF FAR.

UH, THE REASON WE'RE HERE IS THAT STORAGE SHED SALES ARE NOT PERMITTED IN THE EO ZONING DISTRICT.

UH, THEY ARE PERMITTED IN THE GB GENERAL BUSINESS ZONING DISTRICT, UH, WITH A SPECIAL USE PERMIT.

SO SHE NEEDS THE REZONING TO CHANGE THE PROPERTY TO GENERAL BUSINESS.

AND THEN ASSUMING THAT GETS APPROVED, SHE NEEDS THE USE PERMIT TO ALLOW THE STORAGE SHED SALES.

UH, AS FAR AS THE COFFEE SHOP ITSELF, UH, IF THE REZONING APPLICATION IS APPROVED, THAT ACTUALLY BECOMES A BUY RIGHT USE, UH, BECOMES A, A RESTAURANT WITH A DRIVE THROUGH, WHICH IS PERMITTED BY RIGHT.

IN GENERAL BUSINESS, WE'RE THE PROPERTY TO REMAIN ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY.

UH, THE COFFEE SHOP ALSO WOULD REQUIRE A SPECIALLY USE PERMIT.

IT'S AN UNDEVELOPED PAR, UH, TWO PARCELS, UH, PRETTY HEAVILY VEGETATED AS YOU CAN SEE.

UM, FOR ORIENTATION, IF YOU REMEMBER THE AUTO HOUSE APPLICATION FROM A COUPLE, UH, MONTHS AGO, THIS IS JUST A LITTLE BIT TO THE NORTH.

AND ON THE OTHER SIDE OF MOTOWN ROAD, A FEW PICTURES.

UH, PROPERTY IN QUESTION IS ON THE LEFT.

THIS IS MOTOWN ROAD IN THE FOREGROUND.

ZOOMING IN HERE, AS YOU ALL ARE AWARE THAT THE COUNTY'S EXPENSE, THAT FOUR-WAY, UH, SIGNAL WAS PUT IN AT BULLON BOULEVARD, MOTOWN ROAD, MR. CROSS, WAS THAT THE MR. ZAREMBA? THAT WAS THE MR. ZUMBA OFFICIAL STOPS, LIKE, YES, I HAVE NO FISCAL INTEREST IN THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY, .

UM, BUT I DRINK COFFEE .

AND SO THIS IS, UH, ANOTHER VIEW OF THE PROPERTY.

AND THIS IS, THIS IS HORNER LANE, UH, IN THE FOREGROUND.

AND THEN LOOKING DOWN, UH, TOWARD OLD, UH, THE END OF OLD MOTOWN ROAD, WHICH IS A DEAD END STREET.

UM, IN THE PICTURE, IT LOOKS LIKE THE TRUCK IS, IS COMING DOWN THE ROAD, BUT IT'S ACTUALLY PARKED OUT THERE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET.

THAT'S, THAT'S, UH, THAT'S GONNA HAVE TO GO AT SOME POINT.

UM, BUT THERE'S NOTHING AT THE END OF THE STREET OTHER THAN, LIKE I SAID, A, A A COUPLE OF HOUSES ON THE JAMES CITY COUNTY SIDE.

AND THEN, OH, THIS IS ONE OF THE HOUSES, THE ONE THAT'S, UH, KIND OF CLOSE TO, UH, OLD MOORE TOWN ROAD OVER IN JAMES CITY COUNTY.

UH, HERE IS THE SKETCH PLANT SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT.

UM, THERE WOULD BE, UH, LANDSCAPE BUFFERS ON ALL THREE SIDES OF THE PROPERTY.

20 FOOT BUFFER ON HORNER LANE, 20 FOOT BUFFER ON OLD MOTOWN ROAD, AND 45 FOOT BUFFER ON MOTOWN ROAD.

MOTOWN IS A GREEN BELT ROAD, SO A 45 FOOT, UH, UH, UNDISTURBED BUFFER IS REQUIRED ALONG MOTOWN ROAD.

UH, IT'S KIND OF ODD BECAUSE ALL THREE, UH, ALL THREE SIDES

[01:10:01]

OF THE PROPERTY ARE TECHNICALLY FRONT YARDS.

SO YOU'VE GOT, UH, MORE EXTENSIVE LANDSCAPE BUFFERS, UH, ON OLD MOTOWN ROAD AND HORNER LANE THAN OTHERWISE BE REQUIRED.

THE MAIN ENTRANCE WOULD BE ON HORNER LANE.

UH, THERE'S A SECONDARY ENTRANCE, UH, THAT O THAT GOES BACK TO THE, UH, 6,000 SQUARE FOOT GRAVEL AREA WHERE THE STORAGE SHEDS WOULD BE, UM, STORED.

AND, UH, BUT THIS WOULD BE THE MAIN ENTRANCE RIGHT HERE.

HORNER LANE, UH, ACROSS, UH, ACROSS FROM THE ENTRANCE TO THE FUTURE, ENTRANCE TO THE BUS TRANSFER FACILITY THAT'S GONNA BE BUILT OVER THERE.

UH, YOU CAN SEE THE, UH, UH, DRIVE THROUGH LANE WITH THE 11 REQUIRED STACKING SPACES, SHOWING 33 PARKING SPACES, UH, ON THE PROPERTY.

IT'S, UH, FEWER THAN THE ZONING ONE TYPICALLY REQUIRES, BUT THERE IS A PROVISION TO DEVIATE FROM THOSE STANDARDS, UH, WHEN YOU CAN, UH, JUSTIFY IT BASED ON, UH, COMPARABLE USES THAT GENERATE, UH, LESS PARKING.

AND ALSO THE I T E PARKING GENERATION MANUAL IN THIS CASE.

BOTH OF THOSE APPLY.

UH, WE, UH, THE APPLICANT PROVIDED US WITH SOME COUNTS FROM, UH, HER EXISTING BUSINESS OVER THERE IN JAMES CITY COUNTY, WHICH OBVIOUSLY IS A VERY COMPARABLE BUSINESS.

AND, UH, UH, THESE WERE HER BUSIEST HOURS, UH, THURSDAY MORNING, FRIDAY MORNING, SATURDAY MORNING, AND SHE ONLY HAD, UH, WELL, SHE HAD, UH, OVER A TWO, TWO AND A HALF HOUR PERIOD, TWO TO TO 25, UM, UH, CARS THERE.

AND, UH, UH, I WENT OUT THERE SATURDAY MORNING, UH, I GUESS A MONTH AND A HALF AGO JUST TO VERIFY THAT.

AND, UH, MY WIFE AND I WERE THERE FOR AN HOUR AND A HALF.

AND, UH, UH, THERE WERE NEVER MORE THAN 14, UH, 14 CARS IN THE PARKING LOT.

SO I, I, I THINK IN THIS CASE, THE PARKING REDUCTION IS WARRANTED.

UH, THERE IS A STOP GAP IF THERE SHOULD BE SOME KIND OF PROBLEM.

AND THAT WOULD BE THE GRAVEL, UH, STORAGE.

SHE, UM, IT'S A 2,650 SQUARE FOOT, UH, COFFEE SHOP, UH, WITH ABOUT A 200 SQUARE FOOT OFFICE FOR THE STORAGE SHED BUSINESS.

UH, BUSINESS WOULD BE OPEN BETWEEN, UH, FROM SEVEN TO THREE O'CLOCK.

UM, THE APPLICANT INDICATED THAT, UH, MOST OF HER STORAGE SHED SALES, OR AT LEAST A GOOD NUMBER OF THEM, UH, UH, WOULD TAKE PLACE AFTER HOURS.

UH, A LOT OF THAT BUSINESS IS, UH, GENERATED, UH, THROUGH INTERNET INQUIRIES AND BY APPOINTMENT, RATHER THAN PEOPLE JUST DRIVING BY AND DECIDING BY A SHED.

IT'S NOT REALLY A, A DRIVE BY USE.

UM, AND, UH, UH, SHE SUBMITTED SOME, UH, BUILDING ELEVATIONS OF THE PROPOSED BUILDING.

UH, THIS IS NOT IN THE T C M, SO THERE ARE NO SPECIAL, UH, ARCHITECTURAL, UH, GUIDELINES OF ANY SORT.

THE, UH, WHEN WE LOOK AT TRAFFIC IMPACTS, WE USUALLY GO TO THE I T E TRIP GENERATION MANUAL.

IN THIS CASE, THAT IS, UH, NOT A, THAT IS NOT A , NOT AN EFFECTIVE, UH, UH, AN EFFECTIVE RESOURCE BECAUSE THERE'S, UH, THE DATA SHOWS THAT THERE'S BASICALLY NO CORRELATION BETWEEN SQUARE FOOTAGE AND, UH, NUMBER OF TRIPS FOR, UH, COFFEE SHOPS, DONUT SHOPS.

UH, SO WE GO BY EMPIRICAL DATA, UH, WHICH I DISCUSSED EARLIER, UH, WHICH INDICATES MAXIMUM 10 15 VEHICLES PER HOUR AT THEIR CURRENT LOCATION.

UH, YOU WOULD EXPECT THAT TO PICK UP THE DRIVE THROUGH WINDOW, THERE WOULD BE NO P M P HOUR TRAFFIC, BECAUSE AGAIN, THE BUSINESS CLOSES AT THREE O'CLOCK.

AND AS YOU SAW ON THE PICTURES, UM, THERE IS ALREADY A, A DEDICATED LEFT TURN LANE FROM MOTOWN ROAD TO HORNER LANE TO TO THE BUSINESS.

THERE'S A DEDICATED RIGHT TURN LANE COMING THE OTHER WAY, UH, DOWN MOTOWN ROAD AND, UH, ONTO HORNER LANE AND INTO THE BUSINESS.

AND HORNER LANE ITSELF IS A FOUR LANE ROAD THAT CARRIES ONLY ABOUT 200 VEHICLES PER DAY.

SO YOU'VE GOT A TON OF CAPACITY OUT THERE, UH, AND VERY LITTLE VOLUME, UH, BASICALLY THE, UH, THE EXISTING ROAD INFRASTRUCTURES IN THERE TO SUPPORT THIS BUSINESS.

AND AGAIN, THE TRAFFIC SIGNAL IS, IS, IS A PIECE OF THAT AS WELL.

THE, UH, CONDITIONAL, THE ZONING IS A CONDITIONAL REZONING WITH PROFFERED CONDITIONS.

THEY HAVE PROFFERED TO PROVIDE, UH, A MONUMENT SIGN RATHER THAN A POLE SIGN ON MOTOWN ROAD, WHICH IS WHAT WE LIKE TO SEE ON MOTOWN ROAD, UH, WASN'T SHOWN ON THE SKETCH PLAN, BUT, UH, THEY HAVE PROFFERED TO PROVIDE A PRIVACY FENCE, UH, TO SCREEN VIEWS OF THE SHEDS FROM MOTOWN ROAD.

THIS WOULD BE SORT OF ALONG THE, UH, MOTOWN ROAD SIDE OF THE, UH, PROPOSED GRAVEL STORAGE YARD.

AND THEY HAVE PROFFERED TO PROHIBIT CERTAIN, UH, VARIOUS USES.

YOU CAN SEE THE LIST HERE THAT WOULD OTHERWISE BE PERMITTED, UH, IF THE PROPERTY WERE REZONED.

GENERAL BUSINESS PROPERTY HAS BEEN DESIGNATED FOR, UH, COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT SINCE 1991.

THE

[01:15:01]

ORIGINAL COMP PLAN, UH, WE DON'T BELIEVE THERE'LL BE ADVERSE IMPACTS ON THE SURROUNDING AREA.

AGAIN, IT'S A DAYTIME BUSINESS.

UH, THE, THE, THOSE TWO HOUSES ON JAMES CITY COUNTY, THERE'D BE NO, UM, NO DISRUPTION THERE.

THERE'S REALLY NO TRAFFIC GOING BACK THERE EXCEPT OCCASIONAL DELIVERIES AND PICKUPS OF SHEDS.

UH, SO IT REALLY SHOULDN'T HAVE ANY, UH, ADVERSE IMPACTS, UH, ON THOSE HOMEOWNERS.

SO WE RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF BOTH APPLICATIONS, THE REZONING THROUGH ORDINANCE 23 DASH 11, THE RES, THE USE PERMIT THROUGH RESOLUTION R 23 DASH ONE 12.

UH, WE DID, UH, WE DID, UH, UH, NOTIFY JAMES CITY COUNTY AS REQUIRED BY THE CODE OF VIRGINIA, AND THEY OFFERED, THEY HAD NO COMMENTS ON THE APPLICATION PLANNING COMMISSION, CONSIDERED THE APPLICATION BACK ON ITS JULY 12TH MEETING AND VOTED SEVEN ZERO TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL.

UH, THE, UH, THE APPLICANT, MS. LEE IS HERE AND HER, UH, REPRESENTATIVE MR. GETTY, UH, TO SPEAK ON HER BEHALF, AND I'D BE HAPPY TO TAKE ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE FOR ME AT THIS TIME.

YOU ANYONE HAVE A QUESTIONS FOR THE STAFF? NO.

REAL QUICK, MR. CROSS, UH, A COFFEE SHOP AND A STORAGE SHED.

SALES, ISN'T THAT LIKE AN EXCITING NEW COMBINATION OF A BUSINESS HERE IN, IN COUNTY? WELL, WE'VE BEEN AMERICA'S FUTURE SINCE 1781, SO, ALL RIGHT.

ANYTHING ELSE? THAT'S IT.

IS THAT IT? NO, THAT'S ENOUGH.

STEVE, YOU GOT A QUESTION? A COUPLE COUPLE QUESTIONS.

UM, I THINK YOU SAID THAT THE, UM, THE OFFICES FOR THE STORAGE SHED IS IN THE BUILDING WITH, BUT THE COFFEE SHOP, IS THAT WHAT YOU SAID? YES, SIR.

SO THE GRAVEL IS JUST FOR, IT'S JUST FOR THE, UH, STORAGE.

THE SHEDS THEMSELVES, UH, THEY'RE, THEY'RE FOR DISPLAY.

UH, PEOPLE WANNA COME AND LOOK AT THE SHEDS, YOU KNOW, THEY CAN GO OUT THERE, UH, WHETHER THEY MAKE, YOU KNOW, DO IT BY APPOINTMENT OR SOMETIMES PEOPLE JUST COME AND GET COFFEE AND THEY'RE WALKING AROUND AND THEY, AND THEY, UH, LOOK AT THE SHEDS.

BUT YEAH, THAT'S JUST FOR THE, UH, DISPLAY.

UH, A LOT OF THESE SHEDS ARE ACTUALLY MANUFACTURED ON SITE.

YOU KNOW, THEY'RE BUILT, UH, SO THEY'RE VERY HIGH-END SHEDS.

THEY'RE MANUFACTURED ON SITE OR OFF SITE? A A LOT OF THEM ARE WELL ON THE, ON THE SITE, NOT ON HER SITE, THE SIDE OF THE PERSON BUYING THE SHED.

I GOTCHA.

NOT JUST TRUCKED IN AND, YOU KNOW, PLACED ON THE GROUND SOMEWHERE.

I GOTCHA.

UM, DO WE HAVE ANY ANTICIPATION, WHICH IS GONNA BE THE PRIMARY BUSINESS? THE SHEDS OR THE, OH, THE COFFEE SHOP.

COFFEE SHOP.

SHE INDICATED THAT, UH, AT, AT HER CURRENT, HER CURRENT LOCATION.

SHE WOULD, SHE, I THINK SHE SAID SHE'S NEVER HAD MORE THAN FIVE SHED CUSTOMERS ON A GIVEN DAY.

AND SOMETIMES IT'S ZERO.

AND, AND LAST QUESTION.

SINCE THE WATER FACILITY SHOULD BE GOING UP RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET, IS THERE PROVISION FOR SOME TYPE OF CROSSWALK FOR PEOPLE THERE TO WALK OVER TO GET COFFEE AND BACK AND FORTH? OR IS THAT PART OF THE CONCEPT? UM, THAT COULD BE, UH, CONSIDERED, I GUESS, BUT THERE IS CURRENTLY NO, NO PROVISION FOR THAT.

THANKS.

IT'S A VERY QUIET ROAD YOU COULD WALK ACROSS.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? WELL, ANY QUESTIONS? NO.

UM, THE APPLICANT OR REPRESENTATIVE, COME FORWARD PLEASE.

YOU GOT, UH, 10 MINUTES IF YOU NEED IT.

EXCUSE ME, MR. CHAIRMAN, MEMBERS OF THE BOARD.

I'M VERNON GETTY OF 1177 JAMESTOWN ROAD HERE.

MY PLEASURE TO REPRESENT NANCY LEE.

UH, UH, ENTREPRENEUR EXTRAORDINAIRE, WHO HAS COME UP WITH THE COMBINATION OF USES BEFORE YOU TONIGHT AND HAS BEEN VERY SUCCESSFUL WITH IT.

MR. GETTY, MAKE SURE YOU MIC'S UP MICROPHONE CLOSE BECAUSE IT'S REALLY HARD TO HEAR YOU.

UM, NANCY IS THE OWNER OF THE EXISTING FLIPPING FLEET.

UM, SHE'S IN RICH ON RICHMOND ROAD NOW, SORT OF BY COLONIAL HERITAGE ACROSS FROM THE POTTERY.

AND AS, UH, TIM MENTIONED, UM, THAT SHOPPING CENTER IS GOING TO BE SOLD PROBABLY SHORTLY, HOPEFULLY SHORTLY.

AND, UM, SHE'LL BE LOOKING TO MOVE.

UM, SHE AND HER HUSBAND ARE LONGTIME YORK COUNTY RESIDENTS AND ARE LOOKING FORWARD TO GETTING THEIR BUSINESS INTO YOUR COUNTY.

UM, THE ONLY THING I'LL SHOW YOU, TIM HAS SHOWN YOU THE SITE LAYOUT.

UH, THE LITTLE RED LINE HERE IS THE LOCATION OF THE PRIVACY FENCE THAT WILL GO AROUND THE SHED STORAGE AREA.

UM, A AS TIM SAID, THE SITE'S BEEN DESIGNATED FOR COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT FOR SOME 30 YEARS NOW, AND HIS ZONE DO FERGUSON'S ACROSS THE STREET.

WADDLE WILL BE ACROSS HORNER ROAD, HORNER LANE.

AND, UM, IT PROPOSAL IS CONSISTENT WITH YOUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

IT'S A LOW TRAFFIC GENERATOR, AND AS HE SAID, ALL THE TRAFFIC IMPROVEMENTS YOU COULD WANT ARE ALREADY THERE.

UM, THE USES WILL BE WELL BUFFERED, PARTICULARLY WITH THE 45 FOOT GREEN BELT ALONG MOTOWN ROAD.

UM, AND WITH THE PROFFER OF A PRIVACY FENCE, ANY CONCERN ABOUT SEEING THE SHED SHOULD BE, UM, TAKEN CARE OF WITH THE PROPER

[01:20:01]

CONDITIONS.

WITH THE MONUMENT SIGN AND THE LIMITATIONS OF USES, THE ZONING IS VIRTUALLY IDENTICAL AS IT WOULD BE IF IT'S STATE EO.

UM, WE CAME UP WITH THAT LIST OF PROHIBITED USES 'CAUSE THERE ARE THINGS THAT ARE PERMITTED IN GB BUT NOT IN EO.

SO THE ZONING IS, IS VIRTUALLY THE SAME.

UH, THERE ARE JUST NO ADVERSE IMPACTS FROM THE PROPOSAL.

IT'LL GENERATE SOME TAX DOLLARS FOR THE COUNTY, AND I THINK IT'S AN EXCELLENT USE OF THIS SMALL TRIANGULAR PARCEL.

SO WE OBVIOUSLY AGREE WITH THE STAFF ANALYSIS AND RECOMMENDATION AND THE, UH, UNANIMOUS PLANNING COMMISSION RECOMMENDATION AND, UH, AN APPROVAL WILL ALLOW MS. LEE, UH, AGAIN, A VERY SUCCESSFUL SMALL BUSINESS OWNER AND ENTREPRENEUR TO GET HER BUSINESS GOING IN THE COUNTY.

AND WE WOULD RESPECTFULLY ASK FOR YOU TO GRANT APPROVAL.

OF COURSE, THEY'RE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.

OKAY, LET'S START WITH WAL, ANY QUESTIONS? NO, SIR.

STEVE, HOW QUICKLY DOES ONE PICK UP A SHED? COME ON SITE, PICK THE SHED UP AND HEAD BACK OFF.

I MEAN, IT COULD BE AS QUICK AS 20 MINUTES.

THEY'RE, OR THEY'RE ALREADY CONSTRUCTED.

YEAH, THAT'S PRETTY QUICK.

AND, AND THEY'RE, THEY'RE NOT PRE-CONSTRUCTED.

THEY TAKE A, A CONSTRUCTED SHED OFF PROPERTY AND, AND SET IT UP AT THEIR HOME.

IS THAT IS PO YES, THAT IS ONE OF THE WAYS TO PURCHASE ONE OF OUR BUILDINGS.

SO ABOUT 15, 20 MINUTES, THEY'RE IN AND OUT AND DONE FOR THE DAY.

DONE FOR THE DAY.

OKAY, SHEILA? NO, I DON'T HAVE ANY QUESTIONS.

I THINK IT'S A GOOD IDEA.

SO, SO PEOPLE COME INTO THE COFFEE SHOP, THEY DRINK A BUNCH OF COFFEE, THEY GET ALL WIRED UP, THEY GO OUT AND THEY MAKE THIS BUY FOR THESE.

I, I THINK IT'S A GREAT IDEA.

YOU'RE WELCOME.

GOOD USE OF GOOD USE OF THE SPACE AND HAVE A FEW DONUTS IN THE MEANTIME.

I HOPE YOU GET A FREE DONUT WITH YOUR, WITH YOUR SHED .

ABSOLUTELY.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? NO.

VERY GOOD.

AND I WANNA OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING.

THANK YOU ALL.

THANK, THANK YOU.

OKAY, THANK YOU.

I'VE GOT PUBLIC HEARING, GOT THREE APPEALS SIGNED UP.

FIRST, RANDY EATON.

HELLO EVERYBODY.

I THINK I KNOW MOST OF YOU UP THERE.

I'M RANDY EATON.

I LIVE AT 1 0 4 NEVADA CIRCLE AND DISTRICT ONE.

AND JEFF AND NANCY ARE MY NEIGHBORS.

I'VE KNOWN JEFF AND NANCY FOR A LONG TIME.

UH, WHEN JEFF WAS A DEPUTY, HIM AND I HAVE DONE DIFFERENT COMMUNITY THINGS, FUNDRAISERS AND STUFF, YOU KNOW, FOR CHARITY AND EVERYTHING TOGETHER.

UM, WHATEVER THEY SAY THEY'RE GONNA DO, YOU KNOW, JEFF BROUGHT ME OVER AND HE SHOWED ME THE PLANS AND I LOOKED AT IT AND I'M LIKE, WELL, HOW MUCH IS THIS GONNA COST COUNTY? 'CAUSE THAT'S WHAT I ALWAYS LOOK AT.

YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT? AND I LOOKED AND I SAID, THIS LOOKS GOOD, BUT IT'S A REAL COMPACT, YOU KNOW, LOT LIKE THAT.

BUT I WELCOME THEM COMING SINCE THEY LIVE IN YORK COUNTY TO BRING THEIR BUSINESS OVER TO YORK COUNTY.

UM, AS FAR AS THE SHED'S CONCERNED, THOSE ARE REALLY HIGH QUALITY SHEDS.

THEY'RE LIKE, SHE SHEDS, I GUESS YOU WOULD CALL 'EM, BUT THEY'RE REALLY NICE.

AND, UH, I'VE SEEN THEM OVER AT THE PLACE OVER ON ROUTE 60, AND I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH IT, SO I'M GONNA ASK YOU ALL TO VOTE FOR IT.

JEFF AND NANCY AND THE KIND OF BUSINESS THEY RUN.

THANK YOU, SIR.

JOHN SCOTT, MR. CHAIRMAN, UH, MEMBERS OF THE BOARD.

UH, MY NAME IS JOHN SCOTT.

UH, I, UH, UNTIL A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, UH, WAS A RESIDENT IN NORTHERN VIRGINIA, MOVED DOWN TO, UH, WILLIAMSBURG.

UH, MY WIFE AND I LIVE AT, UH, COLONIAL HERITAGE.

WE ARE LITERALLY RIGHT AROUND THE CORNERS.

WHAT'S YOUR ADDRESS? UH, 4 1 9 0 WINTHROP CIRCLE.

OKAY, THANK YOU.

UH, WE ARE LITERALLY, AS I SAY, RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER FROM, UH, THE, UH, SIP AND FLEA.

UH, WHEN WE CAME DOWN THREE YEARS AGO, ONE OF THE FIRST THINGS I DID, UH, WAS, UH, TRY TO SCOUT OUT A COUPLE OF POSSIBLE COFFEE SHOPS.

I'VE, UH, LONG ENJOYED HAVING A CUP OF COFFEE IN A PLACE WHERE I CAN SIT AND RELAX AND READ A BOOK OR TALK TO PEOPLE, THAT SORT OF THING.

I STOPPED AT THE, UH, SIP AND FLEA.

I GOT THERE A FEW MINUTES AFTER THREE O'CLOCK.

UH, THEY CLOSE AT THREE, SO GOT OUTTA MY CAR, WALKED UP, CHECKED THE, UH, HOURS, WENT BACK TO THE CAR, AT WHICH POINT, UH, NANCY'S HUSBAND JEFF CAME OUT OF THE BUILDING, SAID HELLO, INTRODUCED HIMSELF, SAID HE WAS SORRY THAT, UH, THEY WERE CLOSED, BUT HOPED THAT I WOULD, UH, COME BACK AND, UH, AND HAVE A CUP OF COFFEE WITH THEM IN MY SUM, 75 YEARS OF, UH, BEING ON THE PLANET, THAT IS THE FIRST TIME I'VE EVER HAD SOMEBODY COME OUT OF THEIR SHOP, GREET ME AND WELCOME ME IN, UH, NEXT TIME AROUND.

UH, THAT SPOKE VOLUMES TO ME ABOUT, UH,

[01:25:01]

AND I HAVE FOUND THAT IT, UH, WAS AN ABSOLUTELY ACCURATE ASSESSMENT ON MY PART.

I AM THERE PROBABLY THREE OR FOUR TIMES A WEEK.

MY WIFE AND I, UH, POP IN, UH, REGULARLY.

I STRONGLY RECOMMEND THE, UH, CAPPUCCINO AND THE, UH, UH, MINI DONUTS.

UH, BUT WHAT I REALLY RECOMMEND IS THE FACT THAT JEFF AND NANCY RUN A SHOP WHERE THE CUSTOMER IS WELCOME TO SIT.

UH, THIS IS NOT A COFFEE SHOP WHERE YOU WALK IN, ORDER YOUR COFFEE, GET YOUR COFFEE, AND DON'T LET THE DOOR HIT YOU ON THE WAY OUT.

UH, THERE ARE COMFORTABLE CHAIRS, TABLES, SOFAS, PLACES TO SIT, TALK WITH PEOPLE, READ WHATEVER YOU WANT TO DO WHILE YOU DRINK YOUR COFFEE.

UH, AND IT IS A BUSINESS WHERE, UH, I AND ALL OF THEIR CUSTOMERS, I THINK ARE TRULY COMFORTABLE.

WE REALLY ENJOY IT.

UH, IT'S GONNA BE A LITTLE MORE OF A DRIVE FOR ME FROM, UH, COLONIAL HERITAGE TO, UH, UH, THE NEW SHOP.

BUT IT IS A, UH, JOURNEY THAT I WILL MAKE GLADLY.

NOW I URGE YOU TO, UH, APPROVE THE APPLICATION.

THAT'S, THAT'S NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE.

THANK YOU, SIR.

UH, JOHN HARRY, MY NAME'S JOHN HARRY.

I LIVE IN WELLINGTON ESTATES OVER IN JAMES CITY COUNTY AT 84 0 4 DON PATRICK WAY.

AND I AM A RABID CUSTOMER, OF THE COFFEE SHOP.

AND WHEN MY WIFE, UH, WHO THINKS OUR RETIREMENT SHOULD CONSIST OF GOING TO HOME DEPOT, LOWE'S, AND WALMART, UH, WE SPEND A LOT OF TIME OVER ON MARKTOWN ROAD, AND I DON'T WANT TO SAY ANYTHING BAD, BUT LATELY YOU CAN'T GET DOWN LIGHTFOOT AT THE CERTAIN TIMES OF DAY TO GO AND GET A CUP OF COFFEE.

AND BEFORE EVERYBODY SAYS YOU CAN GET COFFEE AT TACO BELL, NO, YOU CAN'T GET A COFFEE ANYWHERE OVER THERE.

SIT DOWN AND HAVE A DECENT CUP OF COFFEE WITH A, A DONUT OR A PASTRY OR SOMETHING.

UNLESS YOU WANNA TRY TO FIND A PARKING SPOT OVER BY STARBUCKS .

BUT TOMORROW THEY, WE HAVE A STANDING 1130 APPOINTMENT WITH ANOTHER COUPLE AT THEIR COFFEE SHOP.

THIS IS, I CAME FROM CONNECTICUT NOW CONNECTICUT IS WHAT IT IS, BUT IT, IT'S, I'VE NEVER BEEN IN A PLACE WHERE YOU SIT DOWN AND IT'S LIKE YOUR OWN.

IT'S LIKE YOU'RE IN SOMEBODY'S KITCHEN AND SOMEBODY CAME TO VISIT AND I'VE SEEN JOHN AND HIS WIFE VICKI THERE, AND WE ALL SIT DOWN AND HAVE IT.

IT'S A PLACE THAT WOULD BE PROUD.

ANY TOWN OR CITY WOULD BE PROUD TO HAVE.

THAT'S ALL I HAVE TO SAY.

I HAVE NO ONE, UH, ELSE SIGNED UP.

ANYONE ELSE CARE TO SPEAK TO THIS ISSUE? SEEING NONE, I WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING.

SO I'M LOOKING FOR A MOTION ON NUMBER 2311.

ANY COMMENTS FROM THE BOARD? SEEING NONE.

ROLL CALL.

THE MOTION MADE BY MRS. NOLL IS TO ADOPT PROPOSED ORDINANCE NUMBER 23 DASH 11 TO APPROVE THE APPLICATION AS SUBMITTED.

I'LL ASK FOR A MOTION TO APPROVE, UH, RESOLUTION R 23 1 12.

I'LL MOVE OUR R 23.

ONE 12.

SO MOVED.

ANY BOARD COMMENTS? SEEING NONE.

ROLL CALL.

THE MOTION MADE BY MR. ROH IS TO ADOPT PROPOSED RESOLUTION.

R 23 DASH ONE 12 TO ADMIT TO THE APPLICATION AS SUBMITTED, MR. MR. MS. MRS. NOEL? YES.

MR. GREEN? YES.

MR. ROH? YES.

MR. ZUMBA? YES.

MRS. MR. SHEPHERD? YES.

MOTION CARRIED.

OKAY, BEFORE WE LEAVE THIS ONE, I'M GONNA TELL YOU IT'S STAFF.

I THOUGHT IT AFTER 22 YEARS ON THIS BOARD, WHEN I SAW THE, THE, UH, THE REZONING FROM EO TO GM, I KEPT MY MOUTH SHUT BECAUSE I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THAT WAS ABOUT.

SO SOMEBODY GO SLAP THEMSELVES.

THAT'S ACTUALLY GENERAL OF BUSINESS, SO THAT'S KIND OF A JOKE.

ALRIGHT, FOLKS.

NEXT ONE.

[3 Application No. UP-1011-23 KSMA WASH VA, LLC.]

OKAY, NEXT ONE.

PUBLIC HEARING NUMBER THREE.

K A S C K SS M A.

UH, WASH VA.

L L C.

THIS IS GONNA BE, UM, THIS IS GONNA BE A RECONSIDERATION, AND I'VE GOT A STATEMENT HERE I'VE GOTTA READ.

MEETING AND A PUBLIC HEARING WAS HELD.

ONE MEMBER OF THE BOARD WHO VOTED IN THE MAJORITY HAS ASKED TO REVISIT APPLICATION UP 1 0 1 1 DASH 23 K S M A, WASH VA, L L C.

THIS APPLICATION WAS CONSIDERED AT THE JUNE, 2023

[01:30:02]

IN ORDER TO DO THIS, AND IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE BOARD'S RULES AND PROCEDURES, UH, THREE DASH 13 MEMBERS WILL HAVE TO VOTE TO SUSPEND THE RULES OF PROCEDURES TO, UM, RECONSIDER THIS APPLICATION.

SO I ASK FOR A MOTION AT THIS TIME, UH, TO SUSPEND THE RULES PURSUANT TO BOARD RULES THREE DASH 13.

I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO SUSPEND THE RULES.

THE MOTION'S BEEN MADE.

UH, ANY COMMENTS? SEEING NONE.

ROLL CALL PLEASE.

THE MOTION MADE BY MR. GREEN IS TO SUSPEND THE RULES PURSUANT TO RULE OF PROCEDURE THREE DASH 13 IN ORDER TO CONSIDER A PROPOSED MOTION TO RECONSIDER THE VOTE ON SPECIAL USE PERMIT APPLICATION U P DASH 1 0 1 DASH 23 K S M A, WASH VIRGINIA, L L C.

RULES HAVE BEEN SUSPENDED.

NOW I'M GONNA MAKE, UH, I'M GONNA LOOK FOR A MOTION.

UH, AFTER I READ THIS ONE, I'M GONNA ASK MR. GREEN, WHO WAS ON THE, UM, WINNING SIDE, IF YOU WILL, ON THE VOTE PURSUANT TO, UH, BOARD RULES THREE DASH 12 THAT THE BOARD RECONSIDER ITS VOTE TAKEN AT ITS MEETING ON JUNE THE 20TH, 23, DENYING APPLICATION UP 1 0 1 1 DASH 23 BY K S MA WASH VA L L C FOR A SPECIAL USE PERMIT TO AUTHORIZE THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A CAR WASH AT 6 4 4 0 GEORGE WASHINGTON MEMORIAL HIGHWAY.

UH, PROPOSED RESOLUTION R 23 DASH 87.

SO, LET'S SEE, ROLL CALL IS GONNA BE NEEDED.

AND MR. GREEN, YOU WANNA MAKE THE MOTION, I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE THE MOTION FOR PROPOSED RESOLUTION R 23 DASH 87.

ROLL CALL IS FIRST OF ALL, ANY COMMENTS, QUESTIONS AT THIS POINT? JUST, JUST A QUESTION.

IS THIS THE, HAS THERE BEEN ANY CHANGES TO THE, UM, TO THE, UH, APPLICATION SINCE WE LOOKED AT IT LAST? WHY DON'T WE GET, WAIT TILL I GET TO THAT MOTION.

IT DOESN'T OCCUR AT THIS TIME.

THIS JUST ALLOWS US TO BRING IT FORWARD.

CORRECT? YES, SIR.

THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT.

ALL RIGHT, WELL, I'VE GOT A QUESTION.

SURE CAN.

THIS IS JUST RULES PROCEDURE AT THIS POINT.

UM, I PRESUME WE'RE GONNA HAVE A DISCUSSION RELATIVE TO YES.

MAKE A VOTE.

BECAUSE THERE'LL BE ANOTHER MOTION REQUIRED.

SO MR. GREEN'S MADE THE MOTION, THE DISCUSSIONS ENDED.

UM, ASK FOR A MOTION TO APPROVE, EXCUSE ME.

EXCUSE ME.

ASK FOR A MOTION TO APPROVE.

THE MOTION TO RECONSIDER.

THE MOTION MADE BY MR. GREEN PURSUANT TO THE BOARD'S RULE THREE DASH 12 IS THAT THIS BOARD RECONSIDER ITS VOTE TAKEN AT THE MEETING OF JUNE 20TH OF THIS YEAR DENYING APPLICATION UP 1 0 1 1 DASH 23 BY KSM A, WASH VIRGINIA L L C FOR A SPECIAL USE PERMIT TO AUTHORIZE THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A CAR WASH AT 6 4 4 0 GEORGE WASHINGTON MEMORIAL HIGHWAY.

MR. ROHN, LET'S TALK ABOUT IT.

MS. MR. SHEPHERD? YES.

MOTION CARRIED.

SO NOW WE ARE AT THE, AS IF WE'RE HAVING THE PUBLIC HEARING, UH, AGAIN.

AND THIS IS ON APPLICATION UP 1 0 1 1 K M S WASH VA, L L C.

THIS IS THE, UH, CONSIDER FOR THE ADOPTION OF PROPOSED RESOLUTION R 23 DASH 87, WHICH IS THE APPLICATION.

AND I'M GONNA GO THROUGH ALL THAT NUMBER STUFF AGAIN TO AUTHORIZE THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A CAR WASH AT 6 4 4 GEORGE WASHINGTON OF MEMORIAL HIGHWAY.

SO, UH, WHO PRESENTED THAT? THE ORIGINAL COME UP, COME FORWARD PLEASE.

SO I'M NOT GONNA ASK FOR A WHOLE REPLAY OF THAT.

I KNOW MR. ZUMBA WAS NOT THERE.

SO AT THIS POINT, THIS IS WHERE THE BOARD CAN ASK QUESTIONS.

SO, MR. ZUMBA, OKAY.

YEAH, I, I READ THE READ AHEAD A COUPLE TIMES AND, UH, BETWEEN THE RITA AHEAD AND DISCUSSIONS WITH ONE OR MORE MEMBERS OF THE BOARD, I'M CONFUSED IN TERMS OF THE GEOGRAPHIC SETTING THERE.

I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE ARE TWO CAR WASHES MAYBE SIDE BY SIDE.

CAN YOU? YES, SIR.

I CAN, UH, LET ME BRING THIS, UH, MAP UP THAT WILL HELP, UM, WITH THAT DISCUSSION.

AND THEN ONCE WE GET THROUGH THIS PORTION, THEN WE'LL HAVE THE APPLICANT COME FORWARD.

GOT THAT ONE THAT WAS THERE.

ONE DOWN.

ALRIGHT, SO, OKAY, HERE WE GO.

SO THIS IS, UM, THIS YELLOW HIGHLIGHTED AREA IS THE PROPERTY UNDER CONSIDERATION.

BASICALLY THEY'VE DEMOLISHED

, UM, ADJACENT TO IT, UH, WAS THE, UH, SELF-SERVE CAR WASH THAT, UM, OVER THE LAST FEW, UH, THE LAST WEEK.

[01:35:01]

THAT SITE, UH, BECAUSE THE BOARD HAD APPROVED, UH, LAST YEAR A, UM, A CAR WASH, A TUNNEL CAR WASH ON THIS, ON THE ADJACENT PROPERTY RIGHT HERE.

AND SO THIS IS THE, UH, LOCATION HERE WHERE THEY PLAN TO DO THE, THE, THE TUNNEL CAR WASH, UM, THAT'S ON THIS'S BEFORE YOU TONIGHT.

SO THIS IS THE SITE PLAN FOR THAT APPLICATION.

YOU CAN SEE THE SELF-SERVICE CAR WASH HERE ON THE, THE LEFT HAND SIDE.

UM, THAT'S NOW BEEN REMOVED.

THERE'LL BE A, BASICALLY A TUNNEL PRETTY MUCH IN THAT EXACT LOCATION, UM, THAT, THAT WILL BE SERVICING CARS IN THE FUTURE.

UH, THAT SITE'S ALREADY BEEN APPROVED AND UNDER CONSTRUCTION.

UH, BUT THIS IS THE PROPOSAL HERE, TUNNEL CAR WASH, UM, WHICH IS BASIC, SOMEWHAT PARALLEL TO ROUTE 17.

UH, YOU'D COME IN OFF 17 OR OFF ONE OF THE BACK ENTRANCES, COME IN, GO THROUGH THE CAR WASH, UH, VACUUM SITES AT THE REAR.

THEY WOULD CLOSE THE TWO, ONE OF THE TWO ACCESS POINTS FROM THE, FROM THE SHOPPING CENTER, UM, THAT ARE BACK THERE.

UM, THEY WOULD CLOSE THIS ONE AND ONLY HAVE THE ONE ENTRANCE.

DOES THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, MR? NO, NO.

GO BACK.

A SLIDE WHERE IT SHOWS BOTH LOCATIONS.

YEAH, THAT, YES SIR.

ONE MORE TIME.

WHERE THAT, WHERE IS THERE THE EXISTING, THE EXISTING IS OLDER CAR WASH, IS THAT RIGHT THERE? SO THIS IS THE SELF-SERVE CAR WASH RIGHT HERE WHERE THE LITTLE ARROW IS GOING.

AND THEN THE NEW ONE IS UH, OR THE EXISTING ONE, THE ONE UNDER CONSIDERATION TONIGHT IS HIGHLIGHTED IN YELLOW.

SO IS THERE ANY CONFLICT OF, UM, ECONOMY WITH TWO CAR WASHES SIDE BY SIDE, OR IS ONE SO MUCH SUPERIOR IN TERMS OF WHAT IT PROVIDES COMPARED TO THE OTHER ONE? UH, THERE'S NOTHING UNUSUAL ABOUT THAT.

I THINK I WOULD, I'LL, I'LL DEFER THAT QUESTION TO THE APPLICANT.

UH, THEY ARE HERE TONIGHT AND I'LL LET HIM ANSWER THAT.

THAT'S MORE OF A QUESTION HE COULD ANSWER FOR YOU.

THERE YOU GO.

WELL, HEY STEVE, YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? WELL, I THINK TOO, MY QUESTION'S PROBABLY MORE DIRECTED TO THE APPLICANT, SO, OKAY.

SHE GOT ANY QUESTIONS? NO, I DON'T HAVE A QUESTION BECAUSE THAT'S A REUSE OF THE PROPERTY.

NO QUESTIONS.

SAME THING, CHAD? NO.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

YOU'RE WELCOME.

I'LL NOW ASK THE APPLICANT TO COME FORWARD.

ACTUALLY, I'M THIS, YEAH, I'M LOOKING FOR THE APPLICANT COME FORWARD.

HI, GOOD EVENING.

UM, MY NAME IS TYLER ROSE.

I'M AN ATTORNEY WITH THE LAW FIRM WILLIAM MULLIN.

AND MY BUSINESS ADDRESS IS 2 2 2 CENTRAL PARK AVENUE, SUITE 1700, VIRGINIA BEACH, VIRGINIA.

I'M HERE TONIGHT ON BEHALF OF THE APPLICANT.

AND ALSO, YOU MEAN THE APPLICANT'S NOT HERE? NO, SIR.

THE, UH, UH, THE PRINCIPALS AT THE APPLICANT ARE HERE AS WELL, UH, AS WELL AS THE PROPERTY OWNER.

I'M HERE TONIGHT JUST TO KIND OF REITERATE OUR POSITION AND PROVIDE, UM, JUST KIND OF A REHASHING OF OUR PRESENTATION LAST TIME SINCE THERE WAS A PUBLIC HEARING LAST TIME, I WOULD SAID, WHO WAS THE PERSON WHO, WHO WAS THE PERSON THAT CALLED THE BOARD, EXCUSE ME, AND TALKED TO US? THE PERSON WHO CALLED THE, THE PERSON THAT CALLED THE BOARD.

THAT'S THE PERSON.

SO YOU GO AHEAD AND DO YOUR STUFF REAL QUICK, BUT I WANNA MAKE SURE WE TALK TO THAT GENTLEMAN THERE.

YES, SIR.

YEP.

THAT'S THE PROPERTY OWNER.

UM, SO JUST WANTED TO, UH, SINCE THERE HAS BEEN A PUBLIC HEARING ON THIS ALREADY, JUST WANTED TO REITERATE A FEW POINTS, UM, KEY ASPECTS OF THE PROJECT THAT WE WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT.

UM, FIRST THAT THE SITE WILL BE OPERATED AS A THOMAS EXPRESS CAR WASH, WHICH IS A NATIONAL, UM, FAMILY OWNED EXPERIENCE, CAR WASH, DEVELOPER AND OPERATOR THAT DEPLOYS STATE OF THE ART TECHNOLOGIES AT ITS OVER 250 LOCATIONS.

UH, SECONDLY, IT'S VERY, UH, IMPORTANT TO NOTE THAT THIS IS A REVITALIZATION OF AN EXISTING CAR WASH AND THERE WILL BE NO NET INCREASE IN CAR WASHES IN THE COUNTY.

UM, AND THEN THIRDLY, IN REVITALIZING THE PROPERTY, THE APPLICANT IS READYING WILLING AND ABLE TO INVEST MILLIONS OF DOLLARS INTO THIS VERY PROMINENT CORNER ON ROUTE 17 TO BRING THE SITE INTO COMPLIANCE WITH THE CODE AND THE COUNTY'S LANDSCAPING DESIGN AND, UH, DEVELOPMENT AND LANDSCAPING REQUIREMENTS, PARTICULARLY THE ROUTE 17, UH, CORRIDOR OVERLAY REQUIREMENTS.

SO WE BELIEVE THAT THIS PROJECT PROVIDES A WONDERFUL OPPORTUNITY TO, UH, REVITALIZE THE PROPERTY, UH, INTO A PRODUCTIVE AND AESTHETICALLY SUPERIOR ASSET SERVING THE COUNTY WITH A CLEAN, SAFE, AND STATE-OF-THE-ART CAR WASH FACILITY.

UM, APPLICANT HAS REVIEWED THE CONDITIONS AND DOES FIND THEM ACCEPTABLE.

I'LL STAND BY FOR ANY QUESTIONS.

OKAY, LET ME, SO IS THIS THE GENTLEMAN HERE? THAT'S WHO'S BUYING THE PLACE.

YOU WANNA COME FORWARD? I WANT HIM TO COME OVER HERE.

BECAUSE I WANT, I'M SORTING OUT THIS THING AND, AND I KNOW WHAT WE NEED TO HEAR.

SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE THE PERSON, YOU'RE THE, YOU'RE THE COMPANY BUYING IT, RIGHT? YES, SIR.

SO I KNOW, I KNOW WALT'S ALREADY GONNA ASK THIS QUESTION, BUT I'M GONNA ASK IT FIRST.

WHY WOULD YOU HAVE THIS ONE RIGHT NEXT TO ANOTHER ONE? UH, WE DO BELIEVE WE ARE FAR SUPERIOR TO.

OKAY, GOOD.

SO THEN ANSWER WALT'S QUESTION, IT'S A LITTLE BIT IN THE WEEDS AND CAR WASH TALK.

I'LL DO MY BEST TO EXPLAIN IT.

NAME, ADDRESS YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS PLEASE.

I'M SORRY.

UH, MY NAME'S MICHAEL BARNES.

I LIVE AT, UH, IN GREEN SPRINGS WEST IN WILLIAMSBURG, VIRGINIA.

UH, 3 0 7 6

[01:40:01]

TORRINGTON TRAIL.

UM, THE CAR WASH THAT'S NEXT DOOR USES WHAT'S CALLED A CHAIN AND ROLLER SYSTEM.

ESSENTIALLY, YOU'VE PROBABLY ALL SEEN THE METAL TRACK THAT YOU, YOUR TIRE GOES INTO WHEN YOU GO IN A CAR WASH.

THAT LIMITS THE TYPE OF CARS IN IN VEHICLES THAT CAN GO THROUGH THE, THE WASH.

OUR, OUR WASH NOT ONLY IS LARGER, BUT IT USES A CONVEYOR BELT STYLE SYSTEM.

TRUCKS WITH WIDE TIRES, DUALLY TRUCKS, VEHICLES THAT ARE LOWER TO THE GROUND.

NONE OF THOSE CAN, CAN GO THROUGH THE CHAIN AND ROLLER SYSTEM, WHICH IS THE CONVENTIONAL WAY THAT CAR WASHES ARE DONE.

AND THE ONE THAT'S NEXT DOOR USES THAT OURS CAN ACCOMMODATE ALL THE VEHICLES I JUST LISTED AND DO IT FASTER BECAUSE OF THE SIZE AND TECHNOLOGY THAT WE, THAT WE HAVE.

HOW MUCH NOISE DO YOU MAKE? YOU, YOU LOOKING FOR VACUUM NOISE, WHATEVER NOISE, HOWEVER YOU REGISTER NOISE.

HOW, WHAT KIND OF NOISE YOU MAKE.

THE VACUUMS ARE NORMALLY WHAT PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT WHEN IT COMES TO NOISE.

I HAVE THE TEST FROM THE, THE FRANCHISOR HERE, RIGHT UP AGAINST THE VACUUM.

IT'S 79 DECIBELS.

WHEN YOU GET FOUR FEET AWAY, IT DROPS TO 70 DECIBELS AND FROM 20 FEET AWAY IT'S 59 DECIBELS DE OKAY.

NOW FOR A FRAME OF REFERENCE, A NORMAL CONVERSATION IS ABOUT 60 DECIBELS.

BECAUSE OF THE WAY WE WE'RE DOING THIS WE'RE, I'M GONNA ASK THE BOARD TO ASK THE QUESTIONS OF THIS PURCHASER OF THE PROPERTY HE'S PUTTING IN A NEW ONE.

YOU GOT A QUESTION THERE? WON'T YEAH, LEMME SET THE RECORD STRAIGHT.

YOU'VE NEVER BEEN ABLE TO GUESS WHAT MY QUESTION'S GONNA BE.

I, I'VE CANCELED 'EM FOR 22 YEARS.

OKAY, SO GO AHEAD.

UH, THE, UM, WHAT'S THE EXPECTATION IN TERMS OF UTILITY OR THE USE OF THE EXISTING CAR WASH ONCE THIS CONSTRUCTION'S COMPLETED? THE EXISTING ONE WOULD BE DEMOLISHED COMPLETELY.

UM, THE CONCEPT, THE ONE, THE ONE TO THE LEFT AS THAT LOCATED THE ONE TO THE NO, WE HAVE NOTHING.

THE ONES TO THE SOUTH NEXT TO YOU.

I DON'T, I MEAN, WE'RE NOT AFFILIATED WITH THAT.

I'M NOT SURE WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THAT.

HAVE NO IDEA.

I MEAN, I, I'M AWARE OF THE BRAND AND, AND HOW THEY OPERATE, BUT I HAVE NO, I HAVE NO INTEREST IN THAT COMPANY.

SO IS THERE ANYTHING DIFFERENT BETWEEN A CAR, TWO CAR WASHES SIDE BY SIDE? MAYBE ONE'S BIGGER THAN THE OTHER, MAYBE IT PROVIDES SOMEWHAT DIFFERENT TO, UH, CAR WASH, BUT UM, IS THAT ANALOGOUS, ANALOGOUS TO MCDONALD'S ON ONE CORNER AND A, UH, BURGER KING? I MEAN I, YEAH, I WOULDN'T, I THINK WE'RE A FAR SUPERIOR, SUPERIOR PRODUCT TO THE CAR WASH NEXT DOOR.

OBVIOUSLY THAT'S AS FAR AS, YOU KNOW, AS FAR AS, YOU KNOW, THERE'S NO, NO PLANS TO DO AWAY WITH THAT CARWASH NEXT DOOR? NOT THAT I'M AWARE OF, BUT I, I WOULDN'T BE THE PERSON TO ANSWER THAT.

MY, MY GUESS MY QUESTION IS, IT'S THE CAR, THE OLDER CAR WASH IS NOT GOING AWAY AS FAR AS WE KNOW IT OR, OR DOING OTHER ONES.

THE OLD ONES AND THE OLD ONES GOING, BOTH OF 'EM ARE BEING DEMOLISHED.

THE, THE, THE OLD ONE HAS BEEN DEMOLISHED AND THEY'RE BUILDING ANOTHER TUNNEL CAR WASHED ON THE SAME SITE ON THAT SITE RIGHT THERE TO THE PAINT TO THE LEFT.

IT'S TO THE LEFT OF IT, RIGHT? YEAH.

SO THERE'LL BE TWO TUNNEL KINDS OF CAR WASHES RIGHT, RIGHT NEXT TO EACH OTHER.

OKAY, STEVE.

HOW MUCH BETTER I THINK IT IS, THAN EVERY OTHER CAR WASH.

SO I'M, I'M STILL AS CONFLICTED AS I WAS AT THE, AT THE PREVIOUS DISCUSSION ABOUT THIS.

SO, UM, WHEN THE APPLICATION FOR THE OTHER CAR WASH CAME TO THE BOARD'S ATTENTION, THE REASON I PROVIDED MY APPROVAL FOR IT WAS BECAUSE AT THE TIME THIS SITE, UM, HA HAD, THEY WERE TO BUILT A TON OF CAR WASH THERE, IT SITE HOSED A, UM, A CAR WASH, OIL CHANGE FACILITY AND SOME DETAILING FACILITY.

AND I FELT THERE WAS, THAT WAS ENOUGH OF A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO SERVICES AND BUSINESSES THAT THEY COULD COEXIST SIDE BY SIDE.

FAST FORWARD TO NOW, UM, I'M, I UNDERSTAND YOUR, YOUR, YOUR DIFFERENCES.

THE WHAT, WHAT YOUR CAR WASH CAN DO.

THE OTHER ONE CAN'T.

BUT FUNDAMENTALLY WE'RE TALKING TO UM, UM, TUNNEL CAR WASHES SIDE BY SIDE AND I'M COMPLETELY SUPPORTIVE OF THE PROPERTY OWNER WANTING TO SELL AND DEVELOP HIS PROPERTY.

AND YOU PURCHASED THE PROPERTY, BRING US A NEW BUSINESS INTO THE COUNTY.

BUT MY CON CONFLICTION IS THAT AGAIN, ESSENTIALLY TWO TUNNEL CAR WASH SIDE BY SIDE AND 2.1 MILES AWAY IS ANOTHER CAR WASH.

UM, THAT'S, THAT'S BEEN AROUND FOR A WHILE TOO.

AND I HAVE RECEIVED FEEDBACK FROM, YOU KNOW, SOME OF THE PEOPLE THAT I SUPPORT THAT WHY DO WE NEED SO MANY CAR WASHES IN SUCH CLOSE PROXIMITY IN THE COUNTY, IN THIS AREA OF THE COUNTY? IS THIS A GOOD LAND USE DECISION? AND THIS IS WHERE MY, WHERE I STRUGGLE WITH, UM, WHY THIS MAKES A GOOD A GOOD LAND USE DECISION.

NO, AND IT'S A TOTALLY FAIR QUESTION.

AND I MEAN, TYLER POINTED OUT EARLIER IT WAS TWO CAR WASHES BEFORE, IT'LL STILL BE TWO CAR WASHES TODAY.

AND I MEAN, I CAN'T TELL YOU ANYTHING RIGHT NOW OTHER THAN I HAVE SO MUCH CONFIDENCE IN THIS THAT I'M GOING TO PAY $1.6 MILLION TO THE LAND AND THEN BUILD A $6 MILLION CAR WASH ON IT.

THAT'S

[01:45:01]

NOT ONLY IN YORK COUNTY, BUT THE ONE NEXT DOOR TO US.

I WOULDN'T PUT A $6 MILLION CAR WASH RIGHT NEXT DOOR TO ANOTHER ONE IF I DIDN'T THINK IT WAS DIFFERENT AND BETTER.

AND WE'RE ALL AWARE OF THE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE RATE ENVIRONMENT RIGHT NOW TO WAIT FOR SOMEONE ELSE TO COME ALONG AND DEVELOP THIS CORNER INTO SOMETHING ELSE COULD BE 5, 6, 7, 8 YEARS.

I'M STANDING HERE WITH MILLIONS OF DOLLARS I HAD TO PUT INTO THAT CORNER NEXT MONTH.

AND I, THAT'S, I'M, THAT'S HOW CONFIDENT I'M, AND, AND I KNOW I'M ASKING YOU A SPECULATIVE QUESTION AND YOU KNOW, BUT THAT I'M EXPLAIN IN MY MIND WHERE I'M, WHERE I'M STRUGGLING.

THE NEXT QUESTION I HAVE IS PROBABLY MORE TO MR. ANDERSON.

Y YOUR PROFFER OR STIPULATIONS FOR THIS IS THAT IF AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE YOU DECIDE THAT TO MOVE AWAY FROM IT, YOU'LL, YOU'LL CLOSE THE BUSINESS, YOU'LL LEVEL THE GROUND BACK TO, UM, YOU'LL, YOU'LL REMOVE THE CAR WASH AND LEAVE IT AS A DEVELOPABLE SITE IS DID I UNDERSTAND THAT STIPULATION CORRECTLY? AND MAYBE MS. ANDERSON CAN PROBABLY ADDRESS THAT BETTER.

UH, THAT'S ACTUALLY A STIPULATION WITHIN THE ZONING ORDINANCE.

THE ZONING ORDINANCE REQUIRES ANY CAR WASH THAT'S NOT BEING USED AS A CAR WASH THAT HAVE THE EQUIPMENT REMOVED AFTER A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF TIME.

SO ALL, SO THEN THE OTHER ONE THAT WE APPROVED HAS THE SAME STIPULATION.

YES, SIR.

YES SIR.

SO AT THE END OF THE DAY, THE BEST CAR WASH WINS IF ONE GOES OUTTA BUSINESS.

WE DON'T HAVE AN ABANDONED CAR WASH THAT ISN'T ON THAT PROPERTY FROM LENGTH THE TOP.

CORRECT? CORRECT.

THAT'S THE INTENTION OF THOSE PERFORMANCE STANDARDS.

NORMALLY, JUST AS WE HEARD EARLIER TONIGHT, WITH RESPECT TO PRINCESS, ALRIGHT, UH, OPPOSITION WILL RAISE ITS VOICE AND WILL LET THE COUNTY, THE BOARD KNOW IT'S AN OPPOSITION.

DOES THE COUNTY HAVE ANY INFORMA INFORMATION FROM WHAT WE KNOW OF THE EXISTING CAR WASH, THAT THERE'S ANY OPPOSITION? 'CAUSE IF THERE'S NO OPPOSITION, YOU KNOW, OUR ECONOMY IS BASED ON COMPETITION AND, UH, LET'S SEE WHAT THE COMPETITION DOES.

BUT I HAVEN'T HEARD ANYTHING TO MY KNOWLEDGE NOR HAVEN'T SEEN ANYTHING.

THERE WAS NO, THERE WAS NO OPPOSITION.

NO OPPOSITION AT ALL.

NO BILL PAY THE COP PLEASE.

MORE OR LESS.

OKAY, SO CHAD, YOU GOT ANY QUESTIONS? NO SHIELD? NO.

SO NOW THANK YOU.

YES, SIR.

SO NOW WE'RE GONNA ASK THE PROPERTY OWNER TO COME UP.

GOOD EVENING BOARD.

MY NAME IS WILLIAM DUGAY AND UH, I SPEAK A LOT.

I'M IN THE CUSTOMER SERVICE BUSINESS.

I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY REASON TONIGHT THAT THAT CAR WASH WOULD NOT BE APPROVED.

BUT TONIGHT, I, I GOT TO BE HONEST WITH YOU, UM, THIS IS A LIFE AND DEATH SITUATION'S.

A GRAVE SITUATION THAT YOU FIVE PEOPLE HOLD IN MY HANDS.

SO I'M GONNA TELL YOU A LITTLE BIT ABOUT ME, FIRST AND FOREMOST, AND MY FAMILY.

MY NAME IS WILLIAM DUGAY.

I RESIDE AT ONE 10 HERITAGE PLACE IN SEAFORD, THE OLD CRAB NECK LOCATION BACK 1790.

I'M AN ENTREPRENEUR AND BEEN THAT WAY MY WHOLE LIFE.

I MARRIED FOR 35 YEARS AND THE REASON THAT I WASN'T ABLE TO BE HERE 'CAUSE I WAS INFORMED THAT I DIDN'T NEED TO BE HERE.

AND I WAS ON A 35 YEAR WEDDING ANNIVERSARY WITH MY WIFE.

AND I GOTTA BE HONEST WITH YOU, I'VE BEEN THERE FOR 20 SOME YEARS.

I BUILT A LOCATION.

I PUT MY HEART, MY SOUL, MY BLOOD, MY SWEAT, MY TEARS AND MY MONEY BEHIND THAT.

I STEWARD THAT BUSINESS FOR THAT LONG.

I I, I WORKED WITH THE, THE LOCAL HIGH SCHOOLS WHEN THEY HAD TO PROGRAM WHERE YOU COULD GET CREDIT TO COME TO WORK FOR ME.

AND WE GRADE YOU AND WE SEND IT BACK.

WE WORK WITH ALL THE FUNDRAISERS, THE CAR SHOWS, THE CHURCHES WE FUND THE LITTLE LEAGUE BASEBALL FIELDS AND WE SPONSOR THEM AND WE BUY 'EM T-SHIRTS AND HATS.

WE'RE STAPLE IN THIS COMMUNITY.

I JUST TURNED 61 YEARS OLD AND BY THE GRACE OF GOD I MEANT EXCELLENT HEALTH.

BUT I'VE BEEN ON THAT SITE FOR 20 SOME YEARS.

ABOUT TOOK ME OUT WHEN OH 8 0 9 CAME.

AND THEN COVID WAS REALLY THE LAST STRAW.

WE OPENED THE DOORS.

WE WASHED ZERO CARS, WE DID NOTHING.

IF IT WASN'T FOR THE GOVERNMENT PAYOUT, WHICH I CAN'T EVEN BELIEVE, I'M GOING TO ADMIT I TOOK, CALLED THE P P P I WOULD'VE ALREADY BEEN CLOSED.

BUT IT SAVED ME.

AND I ALLOWED MY PEOPLE TO WORK AND GET A PAYCHECK AND I USED A HUNDRED PERCENT OF MY MONEY TO PAY THEM.

AND WHEN I SAY THEM, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT YOUNG PEOPLE.

IT'S A CAR WASH.

LET'S BE CLEAR, IT'S BEEN A CAR WASH FOR 20 SOME YEARS NEXT TO A CAR WASH FOR 20 SOME YEARS.

AND WE WORKED TOGETHER IN UNISON.

[01:50:01]

AND BY EXPECTATION, BY GIVING MY FAITHFUL TAX DOLLARS, MY PERSONAL PROPERTY DOLLARS WORKING IN THIS COMMUNITY, AND I'M LOOKING TO RETIRE.

I AM A CAR WASH.

I'M GETTING SOLD.

I'M SELLING A CAR WASH TO A CAR WASH, AND I'M HAVING TO STAND HERE AND DEFEND MYSELF ON A BUSINESS.

WHEN I BUILT, IT WAS NOT UNDER A STAND.

UH, S U P IT WAS DONE.

AND IF I THOUGHT IN A MILLION YEARS I WASN'T GRANDFATHERED AND THAT BUSINESS WOULD AUTOMAT BE ABLE TO BE SOLD IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM, PROVIDED I MET THE RESTRICTIONS SEPARATE FROM SPECIAL USE PERMIT THAT WAS INCORPORATED IN THIS RESOLUTION WAY AFTERWARDS.

AND I THOUGHT I WASN'T GONNA GET IT.

I PROBABLY WOULD'VE RETURNED FOR MY ANNIVERSARY.

AND I GOTTA BE HONEST WITH YOU, I GOT A CALL FROM MY AGENT WHO'S SITTING HERE BEHIND ME AT ABOUT 11 O'CLOCK IN THE MORNING.

AND I WAS DEVASTATED.

I CUT MY VACATION SHORT ON MY ANNIVERSARY BECAUSE I GOTTA BE HONEST WITH YOU, SINCE THAT DAY OF JUNE THE 20TH, IT'S BEEN A VERY STRESSFUL TO COME HERE AND HAVE MY LIFE AFTER 23 YEARS OF DEDICATION IN THE HANDS OF PEOPLE THAT WANNA SAY TO ME, THERE'S A CAR WASH THERE AND YOU WANT TO PUT A CAR WASH NEXT TO IT.

THERE'S BEEN A CAR WASH THERE AND I'VE BEEN NEXT TO IT FOR 23 YEARS.

NO VIOLATIONS, NO CITATIONS.

I'VE DONE NOTHING BUT BEEN A COMMUNITY LEADER.

AND I'M ASKING FOR YOUR VOTE TONIGHT, LIKE YOU GUYS DO WHEN YOU'RE UP FOR A VOTE, I'M ASKING YOU FOR YOUR VOTE.

I APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

I'LL ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT I CAN.

I DON'T WANT YOU TO THINK I'M HOSTILE, I'M SO UPSET FOR SINCE JUNE THE 20TH.

I DON'T KNOW.

I'M BESIDE MYSELF.

AND IF IT WASN'T BY THE GRACE OF GOD, I CAN HONESTLY SAY AND THE AND THE PEOPLE THAT ARE IN MY CIRCLE OF INFLUENCE AT MY CHURCH, ANYBODY SITTING HERE TONIGHT WOULD SHAKE THEIR HEAD, SCRATCH THEIR HEAD AND WANNA KNOW WHY THEY'RE BEGGING FOR AN SS U P FOR A CAR WASH THAT DID NOT REQUIRE IT WHEN I BUILT IT.

AND NOW I GOTTA TURN AROUND AND ACQUIESCE TO THIS GOVERNMENTAL INSTITUTION TO SELL A CAR WASH TO A CAR WASH.

IT DEFIES LOGIC.

SO I WANT YOU TO DIG DEEP IN YOUR HEARTS.

I WANT YOU TO THINK ABOUT IF YOU WERE HERE, WHAT YOU WOULD DO FOR YOUR FAMILY.

MY SON'S HERE WITH ME, MY WIFE'S AT HOME 'CAUSE SHE VOLUNTEERS AT CARENET.

SHE COULDN'T BE HERE TONIGHT.

I WISH SHE WAS.

'CAUSE I WANNA PUT A FACE WITH A BUSINESS THAT SUPPORTED YOU GUYS FOR 23 YEARS AND I'M ASKING FOR YOUR SUPPORT TONIGHT.

OKAY, MR. GATE, CAN YOU, UH, OKAY.

SEE THE BLOOD PRESSURE GOING UP AND WE APPRECIATE THAT.

YES IT IS.

AND I APOLOGIZE.

SO CAN YOU TAKE A FEW QUESTIONS? I ABSOLUTELY WILL TRY.

OKAY, SO WALT, YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? NO, I'VE ASKED.

PRACTICE, A TEAM OF SURGEONS WHO WANTED TO DEVELOP INTO A MEDICAL FACILITY.

YOU GOT ANY QUESTIONS? I, THE APPLICANT ANSWERED MY QUESTIONS.

OKAY, CHAD, AND WE'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT THIS, BUT IF YOU COULD REITERATE LAST TIME, UH, WHEN THIS ISSUE CAME UP, I'D ASKED IF YOU HAD TRIED TO MARKET IT TO OTHER, OKAY.

AND JUST BRIEFLY, JUST BRIEFLY, DON'T, DON'T GET TOO, I GET IT.

JUST LISTEN GUYS, WE ALL WANT TO CHICK-FIL-A ON THAT CORNER.

TRUST ME, I WANT A CHICK-FIL-A.

I CALLED CHICK-FIL-A, I ASKED THEM TO COME VISIT MY SITE.

IT'S THE BEST LOCATION FOR A CHICK-FIL-A IN THE COUNTY BAR NONE.

AND I WOULD INVEST MY MONEY IN A CHICK-FIL-A, BUT I'VE SOLD THAT BUSINESS FOUR TIMES.

THREE OF 'EM FELL THROUGH, I SOLD IT TO ANOTHER CAR WASH IN LEW AND THEY COULDN'T MAKE IT WORK.

TWO DAYS AFTER I LISTED IT, BY THE WAY, IT WAS LISTED FOR 2.2 MILLION AND THEY OFFERED ME 2.1 MILLION.

SO I'M TAKING A SHORT, BUT MY WIFE WANTS OUT AND SHE RULES THE KINGDOM AND I'M READY TO GO.

NUMBER TWO, I SOLD IT TO A LOCAL FIREFIGHTER THAT HAD A DREAM LIKE I DID 23 YEARS AGO TO OWN A BUSINESS.

'CAUSE IN THIS COUNTRY, WE'RE SMALL BUSINESS ENTREPRENEURS.

THAT'S WHAT DRIVES THE ECONOMY, NOT WASHINGTON DC NUMBER THREE, I SOLD IT TO A, A LOCAL MEDICAL

[01:55:02]

MY WIFE AND I PRAYED FOR A GOOD CHRISTIAN MAN TO COME.

AND THEY DID, BUT THEY COULDN'T MAKE IT WORK FOR WHATEVER REASON AT THE BUILDING OFFICE, THE RENOVATION, THE THIS, THE, THAT, THE RED TAPE, THEY BACKED OFF AND THEY PAID ME 1.85 MILLION, PUT IT BACK ON THE MARKET.

BY THE GRACE OF GOD, THESE PEOPLE STEPPED UP.

THEY'RE GONNA PUT $6 MILLION IN A CAR WASH.

THEY'RE NOT WORRIED ABOUT THE CAR WASH NEXT DOOR BECAUSE THAT'S THE BEAUTY OF BEING HERE.

YOU'RE AN ENTREPRENEUR.

YOU PUT YOUR MONEY UP, YOU STAKE YOUR CLAIM AND LET THE LION ROAR.

LET THE LION WIN.

AND ALL I CAN TELL YOU IS I DROVE MYSELF ALL THE WAY TO RICHMOND TO SEE THIS MAN'S BUSINESS.

IT'S SOMETHING TO SEE.

I THOUGHT I HAD A NICE BUILDING ON 17 IN 1999 WHEN I BUILT IT.

IT WAS, IT WAS, BUT TODAY IT'S TIRED AND I'M READY TO GO.

UH, MR. DEE, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

I THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

ONE, ONE LAST QUESTION.

UH, IT WAS BROUGHT UP THAT THE VACUUMS MIGHT BE A LITTLE LOUD.

AND I WENT OUT THERE AND, UH, UH, HEARD HARLEY DAVIDSON WAS RIGHT BEHIND IT.

I HEARD MOTORCYCLES REVVING ON SUNDAY.

LISTEN, ON SUNDAY AROUND CHURCH TIME, I HEARD THE, THE FOLKS, UH, AT THE MOUNT, THEY WERE, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, PRAISING AND, UH, YOU, YOU HEARD THAT.

BUT, UH, YEAH, Y Y'ALL HAVEN'T ASKED ME ABOUT THE DECIMAL.

IT DID COME UP IN ANOTHER THAT WAS AT THE, AT THE, AT THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND, AND THE DECIMALS CAME UP.

AND ALL I CAN TELL YOU IS IF YOU SPEND ANY TIME ON THAT LOCATION, THE LEAST OF YOUR WORRIES ON, ON ANY CAR WASH, WHETHER IT'S MY CAR WASH, WHOEVER'S NEXT DOOR TO ME OR THE CAR WASH DOWN THE STREET, THE LAST THING YOU GOTTA WORRY ABOUT IS A DECIBEL READING FROM A VACUUM CLEANER COMPARED TO A HARLEY DAVIDSON MOTORCYCLE.

I PROMISE YOU.

SO IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT DECIMAL READINGS, LET'S BE SERIOUS.

OKAY? WE'RE IN A COMMERCIAL ZONE ON TOP OF A HARLEY DAVIDON AND I CAN TELL YOU SEVEN DAYS A WEEK THOSE GUYS ROLLING IN WHEN THEM ROARING RUMBLE THINGS AND THEY'RE PROUD OF 'EM AND GOD BLESS 'EM.

'CAUSE THAT'S WHAT MAKES US SO GREAT IN THIS COUNTRY.

GREAT.

THANK YOU MUCH FOR YOUR TIME, SHEILA.

YOU GOT ANY QUESTIONS? OKAY, SO FINALLY WE GOT TO THE POINT NOW AGAIN, PUBLIC HEARING.

I'VE GOT IT OPEN FOR ANYBODY THAT WANTS TO TALK THIS APPLICATION.

SEE NONE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING.

I'M CALLING FOR A MOTION ON RESOLUTION R 23 DASH 87.

I'LL MOVE IT.

I'D LIKE TO MOVE R 23 DASH 87 PLEASE.

OKAY, MS. NOLL MAY IS, ARE THERE ANY COMMENTS BY THE BOARD? OKAY, GO AHEAD.

SO FIRST OF ALL, I WANNA SAY THIS IS A MUCH BETTER DISCUSSION THAN WE HAD AT THE, AT THE JUNE MEETING.

I THINK AT THE JUNE MEETING.

WE JUST HAD THE, UM, REPRESENTATIVE HERE TALKING THROUGH SOME OF THE FACTS AND WE DIDN'T HAVE THE APPLICANT OR THE, THE PROPERTY OWNER HERE TO SHARE MORE INFORMATION.

SO THIS HAS BEEN A MUCH BETTER DISCUSSION.

ALSO APPRECIATE THE APPLICANT COMING UP AND SHARING THAT THERE ARE SOME DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE TWO CAR WASHES THAT IT'S GONNA DRIVE DIFFERENT TRAFFIC BETWEEN THE TWO.

UH, SO I'M GLAD TO HEAR THAT AND I'M GLAD TO HEAR THAT WE HAVE SOME FACTUAL INFORMATION ABOUT THE, ABOUT THE, ABOUT THE NOISE, UM, THE PRACTICAL LIMITATIONS OF THE NOISE AND SO FORTH.

BUT REALLY TO ME THAT THERE IS A, A, A, A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE, THE TWO FACILITIES AND TO HEAR THAT WE DO HAVE THE PERFORMANCE STANDARDS IN PLACE, THAT IF ONE SHOULD FAIL AND GO INTO BUSINESS, WE'RE NOT LEFT WITH A ABANDONED CAR WASH SITTING ON SITE.

WE RETURN BACK TO A, I GUESS A LEVEL PLOT AND IT CAN BE, UM, REINVESTED ELSEWHERE.

SO, UM, SO WHATEVER LAND USE DECISION WE MAKE TONIGHT, UH, WE KNOW THAT IF IF THEY BOTH ARE ABLE TO CO-EXIST AND BE SUCCESSFUL TOGETHER, THEN, THEN THAT MEANS THAT'S WHAT THE COUNTY WANTED.

IF THE COUNTY DECIDES ONE OR THE OTHER THROUGH BUSINESS AND ONE GOES OUTTA BUSINESS, WELL THEN WE HAVE A OPPORTUNITY TO, FOR THE PROPERTY OWNER THEN TO REINVEST THAT PROPERTY ELSEWHERE.

AND WE DON'T HAVE AN, A LONG-TERM EYES SOURCE.

SO AGAIN, A MUCH BETTER DISCUSSION TONIGHT.

MUCH BETTER INFORMATION FOR US TO BASE OUR DECISIONS ON.

AND I, AND I APPRECIATE THAT WE HAD ALL THAT BROUGHT FORWARD.

THANK CHAD.

SHEILA JUST REMINDED ME THAT SHE WAS CORRECT IN HER ANALYSIS ON THE JUNE 20TH MEETING.

SO, UH, I HAVE NOTHING ELSE TO SAY SHEILA NO MORE FROM ME.

ONE COMMENT THAT I WILL MAKE, UH, WHAT'D YOU SEE TONIGHT? UM, HOPEFULLY THIS IS THE SECOND ONE OF THESE REVISITS THAT WE'VE HAD IN, IN 22 YEARS.

IS ANOTHER THING THAT WE GET AND OUR YEARS OF EXPERIENCE BASED ON THAT.

THIS IS THE SECOND ONE I, AND I HOPE A COUPLE PEOPLE OF FOLKS, NOT COUPLE PEOPLE.

I HOPE EVERYBODY LEARNS SOMETHING.

FIRST OF ALL, WHEN YOU COME UP FRONT OF THIS BOARD, BECAUSE OF WHAT WE ARE TASKED TO DO AND CONSIDER AND A RECOMMENDATION FROM THE PLANNING COMMISSION IS PART OF WHAT WE GET.

AND A RECOMMENDATION FROM THE STAFF

[02:00:01]

AND WE HAVE TO DECIDE WHAT'S BEST.

BUT THE OWNERS OF THE PROPERTY, THE OWNERS OF THE BUSINESS, EVERYBODY NEEDS TO BE HERE TO TALK ABOUT THIS.

'CAUSE OTHERWISE WE ARE DEALING WITH JUST PARTIAL INFORMATION.

AND THAT'S WHAT YOU GET SOMETIMES THE DECISIONS THAT ARE INCOMPLETE.

FORTUNATELY, THE TWO TIMES THAT WE'VE HAD THIS YEAR TO COME BACK HAVE BEEN WITH PEOPLE ACTUALLY BRINGING IN, UH, EITHER THEY BRING IN NEW INFORMATION OR THEY SOMEHOW THEY, IT'S EITHER ON THE SIDE AFTER DECISION'S BEEN MADE, UH, WE GET MORE INFORMATION THAT WAY.

SO INFORMATION TO THIS BOARD FOR MAKING AN INFORMED DECISION IS VERY, VERY IMPORTANT.

SO ALL THE LAWYERS OUT THERE, ALL THE PROPERTY OWNERS OUT THERE, WHEN YOU COME BEFORE THE BOARD, YOU BETTER SHOW UP TO BE ABLE TO DEFEND YOUR POSITION.

OTHERWISE IT MAY GO OPPOSITE OF WHAT YOU WANTED TO HAPPEN.

AND I APPRECIATE THE, THE TIME AND ENERGY THAT, UH, STAFF PUT IN GETTING THIS ALL BACK TOGETHER.

SO, ALRIGHT.

SO MOTION'S BEEN MADE BY MS. NOLL.

AND ROLL CALL PLEASE.

THE MOTION MADE BY MRS. NOLL TO ADOPT PROPOSED RESOLUTION R 23 DASH 87 TO APPROVE THE APPLICATION AS SUBMITTED.

MR. ZUMBA? YES.

MRS. NOLL? YES.

MR. GREEN? YES.

MR. ROHN, IN LIGHT OF NEW INFORMATION? YES.

I MADE THE BEST CAR WASH WIN.

[CONSENT CALENDAR ]

AND WE'RE GONNA MOVE TO THE CONSENT AGENDA.

WE HAVE TWO ITEMS. THERE'S A, UH, D VDOT REVENUE SHARING AND TAP PROGRAM, UH, WHICH ARE ACTUALLY TWO SEPARATE PROGRAMS, BUT THEY'RE MONEY WHERE WE, WE DO, UH, ROUGHLY A 50 50 COST SHARE AND MAYBE AN 80 20 IN SOME CASES.

THEN WE HAVE NUMBER FIVE IS THE CHISHOLM CREEK PARK.

REPAVING THE PARK.

THAT'S A, IT'S A WHAT? THE UH, WHAT PART OF IT'S BEING REPAVED? DO YOU, I CAN'T REMEMBER.

I CAN'T RECALL, BUT IT'S, OH, THE PARK.

EXCUSE ME.

THE PARKING, PARKING LOT.

PARKING LOT.

IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT IN THERE.

SO IT HAS TO BE REPAVING.

AND THEN WE, UH, WE'RE GONNA HAVE A, UM, THERE'S A CONTRACT FOR PRINTING AND MAILING SERVICES FOR UTILITY BILLING, UH, FOR THE TREASURER AND THE COMMISSIONER OF THE REVENUE, WHICH ARE PRETTY STANDARD.

SO ANY QUESTIONS ON THESE THINGS? OKAY.

UH, SEEING NONE REQUEST A MOTION TO MOVE THE CONSENT AGENDA.

I'LL MOVE THE CONSENT AGENDA.

OKAY, NOW WE'RE GOING BACK TO THE DOCK MASTER.

CONSENT AGENDA'S MOVED.

ROLL CALL.

THE MOTION MADE BY MR. RONE IS TO PROVE THE CONSENT CALENDAR AS SUBMITTED.

[7 Application No. HYDC-232-23, Dockmaster Appeal.]

UH, UH, THIS IS AN APPEAL.

UM, SO, UH, MR. MORGAN, SO THERE'S THREE AGENDA ITEMS RELATED TO THIS.

THE FIRST ONE IS THE BOARD'S CONSIDERATION OF OVERRIDING THE H Y D C.

UM, UM, RECOMME RECOMMENDATION NOT TO APPROVE THE BUILDING.

UH, THAT'S THE LOGICAL FIRST THING TO CONSIDER.

THE SECOND ONE IS A, A ZONING ORDINANCE REQUIREMENT, WHICH, UH, BECAUSE THE SITE PLAN OF THE NEW BUILDING IS 8% LARGER THAN THE SITE PLAN OF THE TWO OLD BUILDINGS, REQUIRES THE BOARD TO APPROVE THE ZONING MODIFICATION.

AND THEN THE THIRD ONE, IF YOU APPROVE, UH, THE FIRST TWO WOULD BE TO, UH, AUTHORIZE THE CONTRACT TO, UH, DEMOLISH THE CURRENT FACILITIES AND BUILD A NEW ONE.

THERE'S A LOT OF, UM, READ AHEAD INFORMATION THAT YOU'VE RECEIVED.

THE FULL, UH, REPORT FROM THE DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE.

THE STAFF APPEAL, I'VE SAID A LITTLE BIT I'M NOT SURE, UM, WHAT MORE YOU WOULD LIKE TO KNOW.

I KNOW, UM, SOME ARE CURIOUS ABOUT WHAT IS PROPOSED TO GO INSIDE THE BUILDING.

UH, PERHAPS WE CAN TALK ABOUT THAT.

I'LL JUST QUICKLY SUMMARIZE MY VIEW, UH, CERTAINLY CAN ACCEPT THAT DIFFERENT PEOPLE HAVE DIFFERENT OPINIONS ABOUT SIZE, SCALE, APPROPRIATE DESIGN.

UM, THERE WERE A LOT OF PRACTICAL CONSTRAINTS WITH THE SITE, TRYING TO NOT ENCROACH ON THE BEACH, GET INTO ENVIRONMENTAL REGULATIONS, NOT ENCROACH ON THE SIDEWALK.

THIS ALL STARTED PROPERLY, SO WITH THE DESIRE TO HAVE LARGER YEAR-ROUND A D A ACCESSIBLE BATHROOMS, AND ABOUT 65% OF THE FIRST FLOOR IS BATHROOMS AND MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT.

SO THAT KIND OF DROVE THE NEED TO HAVE A SECOND FLOOR FOR SOME OF THE OPERATIONAL THINGS.

AND YES, IT DOES INCLUDE OFFICES AND IT INCLUDES A ROOM THAT CERTAINLY YOU COULD HAVE A CONFERENCE IN.

ITS INTENTION IS TO BE THE PLACE WHERE, UM, ECONOMIC AND TOURISM DEVELOPMENT STAFF

[02:05:01]

OVERSEE ALL OF THE EVENTS THAT GO ON IN YORKTOWN ON A REGULAR BASIS.

YOU REALLY NEED TO BE CLOSE BY.

AND THE, UM, THE BUILDING ALSO, UM, WILL BE OUR TECHNOLOGY HUB FOR YORKTOWN, AND IT'LL BE THE HUB FOR WIFI, AND IT WILL BE THE NEW HUB FOR SECURITY CAMERAS, UH, WHICH HAVE BECOME AN EVER INCREASINGLY IMPORTANT ASPECT OF, UH, PUBLIC SAFETY, UH, AT A PUBLIC GATHERING PLACE LIKE THAT.

UM, SO, UM, THE, UH, ONE THING THAT WAS SAID, WHICH I DON'T BELIEVE WAS ACCURATE, IS THAT WE HAD ALREADY PROCEEDED WITH THE PROJECT.

UH, YOU HAVE IT ON HERE TONIGHT TO AWARD THE CONTRACT.

OBVIOUSLY, UM, THE, THERE IS ALSO, UH, A PRACTICAL CONSTRAINT REGARDING TIMING.

IF WE'RE GOING TO DO THIS, WE WANT TO DO IT DURING THE OFF SEASON AND HOPEFULLY HAVE IT DONE BY WARM WEATHER NEXT YEAR.

SO, I MEAN, THAT'S, UM, AND, AND, YOU KNOW, IT'S BEEN SITTING AROUND FOR FOUR YEARS NOW.

SO THAT'S MY PERSPECTIVE.

UM, UM, DARREN WILLIAMS, UH, CERTAINLY IS VERY KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT THE PROGRAMMING OF THE BUILDING, AS IS BETH MERZ.

GWEN, UM, UH, EARL HAS ALSO HERE AND IS, YOU KNOW, BEEN THROUGH ALL THE PROCESS.

SO, UH, WHATEVER THE BOARD, WHATEVER FURTHER INFORMATION THE BOARD WOULD LIKE TO HAVE.

BEFORE, BEFORE WE GO INTO QUESTIONS, UH, KIND OF GIVE US A HISTORY OF THIS.

UM, YOU KNOW, YOU'VE, YOU'VE COME BEFORE THE, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WITH THIS INFORMATION AND WORK SESSIONS AND STUFF LIKE THAT.

, CAN YOU KIND OF REVIEW THAT AS TO WHAT INFORMATION WE HAVE RECEIVED? WELL, UM, I BELIEVE IN 2018 WAS THE FIRST TIME IT SHOWED UP IN THE CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROGRAM.

AND AS I SAID, IT WAS DRIVEN BY, UM, THE NEED PRI PRIMARILY FOR THE, THE BATHROOM ISSUE.

UH, THOSE AREN'T WINTERIZED BATHROOMS. AND THEN, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE PUT IN THE MOBY MAT, THAT KIND OF THE, THE CONCENTRATED POINT WHERE IF THERE WERE GOING TO BE PEOPLE WITH, YOU KNOW, ACCESS AND HANDICAPPED, UH, NEEDS, THAT'S THE PLACE.

SO OF ALL THE BATHROOMS THAT SEEMED LIKE THAT WAS THE ONE THAT WAS KIND OF MOST IMPORTANT TO, TO HAVE ADEQUATE CAPACITY AND, AND BE A D A APPROPRIATE AND BE OPEN ALL YEAR ROUND.

SO THAT'S KIND OF WHAT DROVE IT.

AND, UM, THEN IF YOU, IF YOU KIND OF LOOK AT, WELL, WHERE COULD YOU DO THIS, IF NOT, THERE, THERE AREN'T A LOT OF REAL OPTIONS.

AND SO WE, UH, WE WANTED TO MINIMIZE THE FOOTPRINT.

UH, ONE OF THE, UM, YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF THE AESTHETICS, I MEAN, YOU SEE WHAT EVERYONE SAID.

UM, YOU KNOW, SOME PEOPLE LIKE IT, SOME PEOPLE DON'T LIKE IT.

UM, IN TERMS OF WHETHER IT FITS IN OR NOT AS WHAT IS DOCUMENTED IN HERE, THERE'S A HALF DOZEN BUILDINGS IN YOUR TOWN THAT HAVE THAT STYLE OF DESIGN.

IT'S ACTUALLY A COUPLE FEET, UH, LOWER THAN THE FREIGHT SHED, WHICH IS ON THE SAME SIDE RIGHT DOWN THE STREET.

AND IT'S JUST A COUPLE FEET TALLER THAN THE BATHROOMS WITH THE CAP NEXT TO THE FREIGHT SHED.

SO I, I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE CRITICISM THAT IT'S A MASSIVE BUILDING.

IT IS BIGGER.

IT'S A 3000, UM, 600 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING, WHICH IN THE SCHEME OF THINGS IS NOT A LARGE BUILDING, BUT IT'S CERTAINLY, YOU KNOW, THE CURRENT TWO BUILDINGS IS MORE LIKE 1200 OR 1400 SQUARE FEET.

UM, SO IT IS BIGGER, NO, NO DENYING THAT.

UH, IN TERMS OF THE PITCH AND THE SHAPE, IT WAS AN ATTEMPT TO FIT EVERYTHING THAT THE SPACE PROGRAM NEEDED INTO THE SITE THAT WE HAD.

SO THAT'S KIND OF THE HISTORY.

AND I KNOW YOU'VE, YOU'VE, WE'VE HAD SEVERAL DISCUSSIONS ABOUT THIS BUILDING, UM, IN THE PAST.

WE COULD PROBABLY DO, OR I SUSPECT WITH THE RIGHT PEOPLE, WE COULD DO A BETTER JOB MAKING SURE THAT THE SIZE, THE, THE DIFFERENCE, UH, UM, IN, IN CHARACTER AND SO ON WOULD BE MORE APPROPRIATE THAN WHAT, WHAT I SEE HERE.

ALRIGHT, SO I WILL NOW OPEN IT UP FOR QUESTIONS OF THE, OF THE BOARD.

WALT, YOU GOT A QUESTION? WELL, I FEEL, UM, LIKE MR. GATES, UH, THE PREVIOUS APPLICANT APPLICANT WHEN HE SAID, UM, HE WAS ON A 35 OR 37 YEAR HONEYMOON AND SORT OF MISSED THE ARGUMENTS RELATIVE TO THE, UH, CAR WASHES, UH, I'VE GOTTA ADMIT, AND I APOLOGIZE, APOLOGIZE FOR THE LAST, UH, SIX WEEKS WE HAVE BEEN TRAVERSING SPAIN AND, AND, UH, PORTUGAL.

AND I MISSED ALL THESE DISCUSSIONS WITH RESPECT TO WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE ON THIS AGENDA ITEM.

I, WHEN I LOOKED AT THE, UH, THE ARCHITECTURAL RENDERING THAT, THAT THE ADMINISTRATOR JUST, JUST TALKED ABOUT, AND YOU PROBABLY HAVE ALL SEEN THIS, THIS PICTURE, I SAID, BOY, IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S OUT OF PLACE.

IT JUST LOOKS LIKE IT'S OUT OF PLACE.

AND, UH, WE COULD BE,

[02:10:01]

AND, UM, I DON'T THINK I'M GONNA BE ABLE TO CONVINCE TO ANYBODY ON, ON THE BOARD TONIGHT TO, TO AGREE WITH ME, BUT PULL IT SO WE CAN DO IT ONE MORE ARM WRESTLING, WHAT'S RESPECT TO DESIGN, BUT I JUST THINK IT'S OUTTA CHARACTER AND, UH, I, I DON'T HAVE MUCH MORE TO SAY THAN THAT.

WELL, THIS IS MORE WE'RE IN A PART OF QUESTIONS INSTEAD OF MOTIONS.

SO YOU GOT ANY QUESTIONS? MY QUESTIONS? WHY ARE WE LOOKING AT THIS TONIGHT WHEN IT'S SO OUT OF CHARACTER, IN MY OPINION? OKAY.

UH, STEVE, YOU GOT ANY QUESTIONS? UH, NO, NO QUESTIONS REALLY.

UH, I DO HAVE SOME, YOU KNOW, THOUGHT, THOUGHTS ON THIS AND I DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT IS NUMBER SEVEN IS THE RIGHT TIME TO BRING IT UP, OR EIGHT OR NINE, BUT I'LL BRING IT UP NOW.

THERE'S A TON OF INFORMATION OUT HERE IN THE READ AHEAD ABOUT THIS.

AND TO TRY TO BOIL IT ALL DOWN TO SOMETHING WE CAN WRAP OUR HEADS AROUND.

IT'S CLEAR THAT WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING WITH THE EXISTING FACILITIES.

WE TALKED ABOUT THE NEED FOR A D A COMPLIANT BATHROOMS AND, AND, AND FOUR SEASONED BATHROOMS DOWN THERE.

AND THE DOCK MASTER, UM, SERVICES AND THOSE, AND THAT AND EVERYTHING ELSE DOWN THERE NEEDS TO EXPAND TO ACCOMMODATE THE, THE GROWN NEED OF THE, OF THE RESIDENTS AS WELL AS THEIR VISITORS DOWN THERE.

UM, YOU KNOW, WE'RE DOING A GREAT JOB AND BRINGING IN TALL SHIPS AND OTHER, UM, THE CONTENT SERIES AND SO FORTH DOWN THERE.

AND WE HAVE A HEIGHTENED NEED FOR SECURITY.

UM, WE HAVE THE NEED FOR OUR, OUR TOURISM BOARD AND OUR AMBASSADORS TO BE THERE ON SITE TO HELP ADDRESS THE ISSUE AS, AS THEY MAY COME UP.

SO IT'S A CLEAR NEED THAT WE NEED TO HAVE THE BUILDING THERE.

UM, BUT CHANGE WAS THERE.

PUT A NEWBUILDING IN THERE AND TO PUT SOMETHING THERE.

AND IF WE DON'T WANNA ENCROACH AND UPON THE BEACH OR ON THE ROAD, IF WE WANNA EXIST IN THE SAME FOOTPRINT, WE HAVE TO GO UP TO ACCOMMODATE EVERYTHING.

UM, WHICH CONSTRAINTS OUR ABILITY TO MAKE SO MANY ARCHITECTURAL D CHANGES.

TO PUT SOMETHING THERE.

UM, I FEEL LIKE WE'RE KIND OF IN A BOX.

WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING, BUT WE'RE LIMITED TO WHAT WE CAN DO.

AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT ELSE THAT WE COULD REALLY FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGE.

I UNDERSTAND THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, THE COLOR PALETTE AND THE, AND THE BRICKWORK AND SO FORTH IS CONSISTENT WITH OTHER BUILDINGS DOWN THERE.

SO I DON'T THINK IT'S, I DON'T SEE A GREAT DEPARTURE FROM WHAT'S ALREADY THERE.

UM, I, I HEARD A LOT OF DISCUSSION AND CONCERNS ABOUT, UH, THE VIEW SHED CHANGING DOWN THERE.

AND WHEN I TAKE A LOOK AT THE, THE RENDERINGS AND ALSO DRIVING DOWN THERE MYSELF AND LOOKING, I SEE THE LEFT OF THE PROPOSED BUILDING, THERE ARE TREES THAT ARE ALREADY AT THE SAME HEIGHT OR HIGHER THAN WHERE THE PROPOSED BUILDING IS.

AND YOU HAVE TO GET WITHIN, I WANNA SAY 50 FEET, UH, WATER STREET BEFORE YOU CLEAR THE TREE LINE ON BALL STREET BEFORE YOU BREAK THROUGH.

IT CAN START SEEING ABOVE THE EXISTING BUILDINGS, BUT BY THEN YOU CAN'T REALLY SEE THE WATER THERE ANYWAY.

SO, AND THE, THE VERY NATURE OF BALLOT STREET KIND OF CONSTRICTS HOW, WHAT, WHAT YOUR VIEW SHED IS.

SO I DON'T SEE WHERE WE'RE GOING TO LOSE VERY MUCH, UM, IN THAT ASPECT.

SO AGAIN, WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING, WE'RE CONSTRAINED WHAT WE CAN DO.

ABSOLUTELY.

WE HAVE, WE HAVE THIS OPTION IN FRONT OF US.

I DON'T SEE ANOTHER OPTION THAT CAN ACCOMMODATE WHAT WE NEED TO ACCOMMODATE.

UM, AND THIS IS WHY WE'RE HERE TONIGHT WITH THESE 1, 2, 3 DIFFERENT, UM, PROPOSALS IN FRONT OF US TO CONSIDER.

AS A REMINDER, THESE ARE QUESTIONS YOU'RE GONNA HAVE A CHANCE TO, TO TALK HERE IN A LITTLE BIT.

SO IS THERE A QUESTION IN THERE, ? THAT'S ALRIGHT.

ADVOCATE.

LIKE I SAID, I'M JUST TRYING TO GET THE QUESTIONS OUT.

THAT'S, THAT'S, YOU'VE GOT A QUESTION.

THAT'S A VERY INTERESTING STATEMENT.

DO I HAVE A QUESTION? MY QUESTION IS, WHY HAVEN'T WE WORKED ON THIS FASTER THAN WE HAVE? WE HAVE NEEDED THOSE BATHROOMS DOWN THERE, SIR, FOREVER AND EVER.

IF YOU HAVE BEEN IN THEM, YOU WOULD KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.

AND WE NEED THE SPACE.

SO AS I SAID THE QUESTION, WHY DIDN'T WE MOVE FASTER? OKAY, WHY DIDN'T WE MOVE FASTER? NEIL, IT ONLY TOOK FOUR YEARS TO GET TO THIS POINT OR FIVE? WELL, I MEAN, THE CORE DESIGN WAS DONE SOME TIME AGO, AND HONESTLY, UH, WE PARTLY, WE DELAYED IT BECAUSE OF COVID WHEN TOURISM DROPPED OFF AND WE JUST WEREN'T SURE.

YOU KNOW, IT WAS A LOT OF THINGS WE PUT ON HOLD.

AND, AND THEN, YOU KNOW, ANOTHER PRACTICAL ASPECT OF ALL THIS IS, IS LIKE, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD DO THIS, YOU COULD DO THAT, YOU SHOULD DO SOMETHING ELSE.

WELL, WE'VE ALREADY PAID TO DESIGN IT ONCE.

UM, SOMEWHAT RELUCTANT TO GO OFF AND START TO DESIGN IT AGAIN.

AND I'M SOMEWHAT FEARFUL THAT IF WE DID, WE'D BE BACK IN THE SAME SITUATION.

DID TOO.

IT'S, IT'S NOT A NEW THING.

CHAD, QUESTION, I HAVE A QUESTION WITH A STATEMENT.

, , I FIND THE BUILDING TO BE NOT ATTRACTIVE.

WHO DESIGNED THIS BUILDING AND WHAT EFFORTS WERE MADE TO MAKE IT INCORPORATED INTO THE, I GUESS, OVERALL HISTORIC YORKTOWN DESIGN.

UH, AND WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THIS, UH, THE FIRST TIME I LOOKED AT IT WAS, I'M GONNA SAY 19 OR 20.

[02:15:01]

UH, I'VE SEEN LITTLE MODELS OF IT FLOATING AROUND.

UH, SO IF, IF YOU COULD ANSWER THIS QUESTION.

SO, UH, WE HIRED, UH, YOU KNOW, THE STAFF ARE NOT STETS AND WE HIRED, UH, RICK MOBERG, WHO WAS THE LEAD ARCHITECT THAT DESIGNED ALL OF THE RIVERWALK BUILDINGS.

AND HIS DIRECTION WAS DESIGN A NEW DOCK MASTER, UH, LARGER A D A ACCESSIBLE BATHROOM FACILITY, UH, YOU KNOW, CONSISTENT WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE OTHER THINGS DOWN HERE.

UM, AND YOU KNOW, I, I DON'T WANT TO SPEAK FOR HIM.

I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY THERE WERE SOME, YOU KNOW, LIKE THE ROOF LINE AND STUFF WAS CONSTRAINED TO TRY TO MAXIMIZE THE SPACE PROGRAM.

AND I WOULD ONLY SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'VE DISAGREED ON THE AESTHETICS OF OTHER DESIGNS AND I GUESS EVERYONE ALWAYS WILL.

UM, I DO, THERE ARE OTHER EXAMPLES AND YOU SEE IN ALL THE BACK AND FORTH OF OTHER BUILDINGS THAT ARE NOT UNLIKE THIS.

AND IT'S HEIGHT-WISE, SHAPE WISE, IT'S SORT OF SIMILAR TO THE FREIGHT SHED, WHICH IS RIGHT DOWN THE STREET.

THE, THE, THE CUPOLA, WHICH YOU TALKED ABOUT.

AND WHICH I BELIEVE IS A ADD-ON FROM THE FIRST TIME I LOOKED AT THIS, UH, WOULD HAVE HOUSE ANTENNAS, CAMERAS.

TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT.

UM, SO IT WAS, I BELIEVE, I'M NOT SURE EXACTLY HOW IT WAS ADDED.

I I WAS UNDER THE IMPRESSION IT WAS AN AESTHETIC ELEMENT AND THERE'S TWO OTHER, UH, STRUCTURES DOWN THERE THAT HAVE A CUPOLA, UH, THE BATHROOMS NEXT TO THE FREIGHT SHED AND THE, UM, I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU CALL IT, THEY SORT OF SHELTER OUT TOWARD THE PIER.

AND SO I, I BELIEVE THAT THE ARCHITECT PUT IT ON THERE INITIALLY FOR THAT.

BUT THE STAFF IN PROGRAMMING, IT HAS TAKEN, YOU KNOW, THERE'S ALSO RULES THAT YOU CAN'T HAVE ANTENNAS AND YOU CAN'T HAVE, UM, DISHES ON BUILDINGS DOWN THERE.

AND SO, UH, IT IS BEING UTILIZED, UH, FOR, UM, TECHNOLOGY, LINE OF SIGHT, UM, WIFI CAMERA CONNECTIONS, THINGS LIKE THAT.

I DON'T HAVE ANY, I DON'T HAVE ANY QUESTIONS.

UM, SO NEIL, ON THIS THING, UM, WELL, WE'RE GOT TWO THINGS.

'CAUSE 'CAUSE I'M GONNA GIVE WALTER AN OPPORTUNITY HERE IF HE WANTS.

UM, WE HAVE APPLICATION, UH, THIS IS THE, UH, TO, UH, REVERSE TO APPEAL.

THAT'S THE FIRST APPLICATION.

IT'S TO APPEAL THE, UH, DENYING OF THE, UH, APPLICATION FOR A, UH, FROM THE H Y D C, CORRECT? YES.

THAT'S WHAT WE'RE GETTING, GETTING READY TO DO AND, AND BLENDING.

WHAT WE'RE DOING IS WE'RE KIND OF BLENDING EVERYTHING TOGETHER HERE.

SO WE'RE GONNA PROBABLY REPEAT OURSELVES A LITTLE BIT.

SO I GUESS AT, AT THIS POINT, UH, I NEED SOMEBODY TO MAKE A MOTION, UM, TO APPROVE H Y D C 23 DASH 23, WHICH IS THE APPLICATION.

JUST SAY, MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.

I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.

NOW, OKAY.

AT THIS POINT, WALT, I YOU WANTED TO MAKE A MOTION TO TABLE.

TABLE.

BUT, BUT I HAVE A QUESTION FOR MS. NOLAN.

YOU'RE MAKING A MOTION TO APPROVE, APPROVE WHAT? THIS IS TO REVERSE.

NO, BUT I'M JUST SAYING THAT'S WHAT I'M TELLING YOU RIGHT NOW.

IT'S THE REVERSE.

'CAUSE THIS IS A LITTLE COMPLICATED HERE, BUT IT'S TO REVERSE THE DIS, UH, TO OVERRIDE THE DECISION BY THE, THE, UH, H Y D C.

THAT'S WHAT WE'RE DOING RIGHT NOW.

THIS WILL BE THE VOTE TO OVERRIDE, UM, APPROVING THE APPEAL.

APPROV THE APPEAL.

WE ARE APPEALING THE DECISION, THIS DECISION TO DENY BECAUSE IT WAS PREVIOUSLY DENIED.

THEY HAVE TO GO REMEMBER THEY, WHEN THEY HAVE THE COMMITTEE HERE.

I UNDERSTAND.

I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE, OKAY.

WELL, THEY HAVE THE COMMITTEE.

THE COMMITTEE MET AND THEY, AND THEY REJECTED THE BUILDING.

RIGHT.

SO NOW WHAT WE'RE DOING, THEY THE, BECAUSE WE'RE THE APPEAL AUTHORITY, THEY, THEY'RE COMING TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS ASKED THE, THE, THE, THE COUNTY IS, OKAY, THIS IS AN COUNTY APPLICATION.

UM, AND I'LL JUST BLAME NEIL MORGAN FOR IT ANYWAY.

SO NEIL IS SAID, OKAY, WE WANT TO APPEAL.

UH, AND WHAT BASICALLY DOES REVERSE THAT DECISION? COULD I JUST ADD ONE COMMENT? GO AHEAD.

SO THE LARGEST PROPERTY OWNER IN YORKTOWN IS THE PARK SERVICE.

AND THEY, UH, REJECT ANY AUTHORITY OF THIS GROUP AND NEVER REVIEW ANYTHING.

WE ATTEMPT TO RESPECT THE PROCESS.

WE'VE GONE THROUGH IT ON SEVERAL THINGS.

UH, WE'VE HEARD SOME COMMENTS ABOUT THAT.

WE EVEN TOOK THE GENERATOR FOR YOUR CALL THROUGH THIS PROCESS.

SO, YOU KNOW, LIKE IT OR NOT, I THINK I'D LIKE TO AT LEAST SAY WE'VE ATTEMPTED TO RESPECT THE PROCESS

[02:20:01]

AND, AND GO THROUGH IT.

SO THAT'S WHAT WE'RE DOING NOW.

AND SHE MADE THE MOTION.

UM, AND WHAT I'M GONNA GIVE, WHAT I'M DOING HERE, TRYING TO GIVE YOU A CHANCE, IF YOU WANNA, UM, I GUESS THE WAY TO DO THIS WOULD SAY NO, UH, I WANT TO TABLE THIS FOR MORE, MORE CONSIDERATION.

IF YOU WANNA MAKE A MOTION, THE TABLE, YOUR MOTION WILL HAVE TO BE CONSIDERED, RIGHT? PARLIAMENTARY, SHE HAD YOUR MOTION HAS TO BE CONSIDERED FIRST.

WELL, IF YOU ASK ME WHETHER I SAID, YEAH, ABSOLUTELY, I'D LIKE TO.

OKAY, SO, SO MAKE A MOTION TO TABLE, ALL RIGHT.

THIS AGENDA ITEM.

GOT IT.

SO THAT WE CAN WR IT OUT MORE THAN IT IS BEEN RUN DATE RELATIVE TO THINGS WE'VE, WE'VE HEARD TONIGHT FROM THE AUDIENCE AS WELL AS OUR, OUR DISCUSSION HERE.

THE SIZE, ARCHITECTURAL SHORTCOMINGS AND SO FORTH.

GOT IT.

TOM, I HAVE A QUESTION.

AND THIS IS A PROCEDURAL QUESTION.

OKAY? SO WE FREQUENTLY GET THE PLANNING COMMISSION.

I SEE ONE OF OUR PLANNING COMMISSIONERS, UH, MR. HORO OUT THERE.

WE FREQUENTLY GET THINGS FROM THE PLANNING COMMISSION WHERE WE, UH, COMES TO US AND WE VOTE AND WE APPROVE THEM, OR WE DISAPPROVE THEM.

WHY IS THE HISTORIC COMMISSION ANY DIFFERENT THAN, SAY THE PLANNING COMMISSION? WHY WOULD WE HAVE TO OVERRULE THEM? WHY WOULDN'T WE JUST BE CONSIDERING THIS AS A, AS A STANDALONE MOTION? THAT'S, THAT WOULD BE MY QUESTION.

WHY WOULDN'T IT BE MORE LIKE THE PLANNING COMMISSION? WHY WOULD WE HAVE TO MAKE A MOTION TO OVERRULE? WELL, I, I MEAN, WELL, HANG ON.

HANG ON.

SO I'M GONNA GO TO YOU.

, BUT I WANNA MAKE SURE THE BIG DIFFERENCE IS THE PROCESS, RIGHT? OKAY.

THIS, THIS IS, THIS IS THE CRAP THAT DRIVES PEOPLE CRAZY.

OKAY? SO IT'S, THIS IS THE PROCESS.

I WANNA MAKE SURE WE DOT THE I'S CROSS THE T'S.

SO NEIL, ANSWER HIS QUESTION, .

WELL, THE WAY, UH, THE BOARD APPROVED THE STRUCTURE OF THIS GROUP AND HOW THEIR DECISIONS ARE MADE, I MEAN, THIS IS THE WAY YOU ACT ON IT.

NOW, THERE IS A SCHOOL OF THOUGHT.

I MEAN, AND I WAS TEMPTED, BUT I WANTED TO RESPECT THE PROCESS.

YOU COULD JUST VOTE UP OR DOWN ON THE, THE PROJECT.

I MEAN, YOU KNOW, THIS IS AN ENTITY THAT WAS CREATED BY THE BOARD.

AND, YOU KNOW, ON SOME LEVEL, WE VOLUNTARILY SUBMIT OUR PROJECTS TO THIS PROCESS.

BUT RESPECTING THE PROCESS, UH, THEY, THEY EITHER DENY OR APPROVE, THEY DENIED.

SO, UH, WE'RE BEHAVING AS ANY OTHER APPLICANT WOULD.

UM, SINCE WE ARE THE OWNER OF THE APPLICATION AND THE PROJECT, WE'RE APPEALING THE DECISION.

WELL, HANG ON.

BUT THERE'S ALSO ANOTHER, I THINK ANOTHER CRITICAL PART, IF I'M MISTAKEN.

THE PLANNING COMMISSION IS A REQUIRED, IS REQUIRED BY THE STATE.

, UM, YES.

SO IT'S, THAT IS A PROCESS.

THEY, THEY MAKE A RECOMMENDATION, THEY GIVE A REVIEW.

THEY HAVE TWO PUBLIC HEARINGS AND ALL THAT STUFF.

SO IT'S REQUIRED BY THE STATE.

THERE IS NO REQUIREMENT BY THE STATE TO HAVE THIS COMMISSION.

THIS WAS CREATED, THIS IS SOMETHING WE CREATED OURSELVES.

SO THAT'S WHAT I REMEMBER.

SO THEY ANSWER YOUR QUESTION? YEAH.

NOW, SO, UM, MR. ZUMBA HAS MADE A, A MOTION TO, UH, TO, UM, TABLE.

AND I'M CALL FOR ROLL CALL.

THE MOTION MADE BY MR. ZUMBA IS A TABLE PROPOSED, RE PROPOSED RESOLUTION R 23 DASH ONE 13 TO APPROVE AN APPEAL TO THE, BY THE COUNTY OF YORK, OF THE DENIAL OF A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATE.

I'M GONNA HOLD, I'M GONNA JUST STOP YOU THERE FOR A SECOND.

I JUST REALIZED SOMETHING ELSE.

GIVE EVERYBODY A CHANCE ON A MOTION TO SPEAK.

AND I DIDN'T, BUT SHEILA, DO YOU WANNA SPEAK ON THE MOTION? ON THE MOTION? I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD TABLE IT.

ANYTHING ELSE? WELL, THAT'S ENOUGH FOR NOW.

I'M, I'M, I'M TENDING TO TABLE IT WITH MY GOOD FRIEND FROM THE FIRST DISTRICT.

UM, DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR STATEMENTS? I HAVE A, I HAVE A QUESTION.

IF, IF, UH, THE MOTION TO TABLE IS SUCCESSFUL, DOES IT MAKE ITEMS EIGHT AND NINE MOOT FOR NIGHT? YES.

THIS BIG FUR BALL GOING DOWN HERE.

UM, SORRY.

SO SECOND, IF WE TABLE IT, I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW TO WHAT END DO WE TABLE IT? THE, THE NEED? WELL, THAT, THAT WILL BE TABLE TWO.

WE, WHEN WE DECIDE TO BRING IT BACK UP.

WELL, MORE TO MY POINT, UM, THE NEED TO DO SOMETHING RIGHT, IS INDISPUTABLE.

WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING DOWN THERE.

WE CAN'T, WE CAN'T JUST KEEP KICKING THIS DOWN THE ROAD.

SO IF WE TABLE IT, WE NEED TO TABLE IT TO A DIFFERENT PROPOSAL THAT'S BROUGHT BACK THAT WE CAN CONSIDER.

IF WE JUST BRING BACK THE SAME THING AGAIN.

ALL, ALL WE'RE DOING IS JUST MOVE, MOVING THE GOALPOST DOWN THE ROAD.

SO, SO MY, AT MY QUESTION IS, IF WE'RE GONNA TABLE IT, WILL SOMEBODY GO AND, AND BRING BACK A DIFFERENT ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW, DIFFERENT SUGGESTIONS, OR WHAT, WHAT IS THE POINT OF TABLE ON IT? WELL, THAT'S THE, WE, WE WOULD HAVE TO DETERMINE THAT LATER.

BUT RIGHT NOW, SO WALT'S MADE THE DISPLAY THE POINT.

YOU'VE HAD YOUR DISCUSSION, YOU'VE HAD YOUR DISCUSSION DISCUSS, AND MY DISCUSSION YET, OKAY, HERE'S MY POINT.

IN 2002 WHEN I ACTUALLY COUNT ON THE BOARD, UM, THERE WAS

[02:25:01]

I MEAN, THAT'S ALL I COULD HEAR ABOUT WAS, UH, THE COUNTY WAS DESTROYING THE CULTURAL, UM MM-HMM.

BEAUTY OF THE, OF THE WATERFRONT.

AND, AND, AND THEN WE'RE GONNA TEAR DOWN NICK'S, UH, NICK'S RESTAURANT AND A COMMITTEE OF CITIZENS, TWO SEPARATE COMMITTEES OF, OF CITIZENS HAD FOR 13 YEARS.

I MEAN, DRUG, THIS THING ON FOR 13 YEARS.

UM, AND THEN I WOULD SAY GOD STEPPED IN WITH ELIZABETH ISABEL AND FLATTENED THE PLACE.

OKAY? BUT THEY HAD HER PETITION OF 6,500 PEOPLE, ALL OF 'EM DOWN 17.

AND I GOT THERE AND I SAID, AND I TOLD, I TOLD 'EM, I SAID, IF YOU DON'T MOVE OUT AFTER 13 YEARS OF INDECISION AND GET SOMETHING GOING, THEN I WAS GONNA CAMPAIGN TO KILL THE PROJECT.

UM, AND THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S A, THAT'S, YOU CAN GET, YOU GET PARALYZED BY THIS.

AND EVERY TIME THAT ANYTHING IS EVER DONE DOWN HERE, IT'S BECOME A FUR BALL.

I MEAN, IT JUST BECOMES DONE EMOTIONAL.

YOU'RE DESTROYING THE COUNTY, ALRIGHT? MM-HMM.

AND I APPRECIATE THE INPUTS, BUT THE POINT IS, THERE IS THINGS WE GOTTA DO.

THERE ARE JUST SIMPLY THINGS WE GOTTA DO.

I THINK WE DID A GREAT JOB AND WE TRIED TO KEEP UP WITH THE ARCHITECTURAL DESIGN OF, UH, THE, THE RIVERWALK RESTAURANT.

AND WE PUT ALL, WE SPENT $60,000 ON MULLINS, $60,000.

OKAY? AND NOW THE MULANS ARE GONNA GO OUT, OKAY? BECAUSE THE DESIGN NEEDED CHANGES.

WELL, THEY'RE, IT'S ONE OF THE THINGS I KNEW FROM AQUA CONN, IF YOU'VE EVER BEEN UP, UP TOWARDS WASHINGTON, THE LITTLE TOWN OF AQUA CONN, WHICH IS JUST SOUTH OF LORTON, UH, WHEN THEY CREATED THIS CUTESY LITTLE TOWN AND COME UP WITH ALL THESE GREAT DESIGNS, ALL OF A SUDDEN I 95, WE'D BE BACKED UP FOR MILES.

'CAUSE PEOPLE TRYING TO GET IN THERE.

OKAY? SO YOU BUILD IT, PEOPLE SHOW UP, AND THAT'S WHERE WE ARE.

AND NOW THE POINT WE'VE GOTTA DO IS MAKE A DECISION, GET MOVING, GET THINGS GOING.

ALRIGHT, I DON'T WANNA SIT HERE FOR, WE'VE ALREADY BEEN AT THIS ABOUT FOUR OR FIVE YEARS AND I'M, I PERSONALLY AM NOT GONNA TABLE IT.

I MEAN, I WOULD NOT SUPPORT IT TABLE 'CAUSE I JUST WANNA GET THIS THING MOVING.

'CAUSE WHEN IT COMES OUT, OKAY, THEN WE WILL HAVE A NEW, WE'LL HAVE A NEW STRUCTURE THAT WILL MEET THE NEEDS OF WHAT WE'VE GOT.

WE NEED THE DOCK MASTER, WE NEED BATHROOMS, WE NEED PLACE, NEEDS TO BE CLEANED UP, FALLEN APART, AND WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH SPACE.

AND UNLESS WE ARE GOING TO PUT ANOTHER FOOTPRINT SOMEWHERE ELSE ON THAT BEACH, WHICH OKAY.

AND EXPANDED, YOU KNOW, I I, THIS LOOKS TO ME EXACTLY LIKE, UH, ALMOST EXACTLY LIKE THE, UH, THE, UH, UM, FREIGHT SHED.

FREIGHT.

AND WALT, YOU RAISED HELL ABOUT THAT FREIGHT SHED BEING MOVED.

OKAY? WHEN IT GOT MOVED, IT COST THIS COUNTY A MILLION DOLLARS.

ALRIGHT? SO I'M BRINGING BACK THE HISTORY.

WHAT'S GOING ON? AND THIS IS WHY I'M, I'M, I'M NOT GOING TO, I'M NOT GONNA SUPPORT THE TABLE.

IT, I, I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT STEVE JUST ASKED THE QUESTION SAYING IF WE TAPE, IF WE TABLE IT RIGHT, WHAT DO WE TABLE IT TO? IT DOESN'T, A POSSIBLE ANSWER OF THAT IS A WORK SESSION WHERE THE, THE BUGS CAN BE WORKED OUT OF THE DAMN DIAGRAM OR, OR GET THE ARCHITECT, GET THE ARCHITECT IN THAT WORK SESSION, ROLL UP OUR SLEEVES, ARM WRESTLE, DO WHAT WE HAVE TO DO, MAKE SOMETHING ACCEPTABLE TO THE CITIZENS OF YORKTOWN AND THE COUNTY THAT, THAT BUILDING RIGHT NOW, IN MY OPINION, AND A COUPLE OF OTHER, SEVERAL OTHER OPINIONS AS WELL, IS OUTTA CHARACTER.

OKAY? ALL RIGHT.

I GOT IT.

BUT, UH, WE'RE NOT SETTING ANY DATES HERE TO SET IT TO, 'CAUSE WE GOT THE THINGS WE GOTTA WORK ON IN THIS COUNTY BESIDES THAT BUILDING.

SO WITH THE WORK SESSION, GO TAKE WOULD TAKE, I MEAN IT WOULD TAKE PROBABLY ANOTHER YEAR.

ANOTHER YEAR.

WE NEED TO DO THIS NOW.

WE NEED TO DO IT RIGHT.

IF NOT, WE DON'T WANNA DO IT NOW AND DO IT WRONG.

YES, WE DO.

NO WAIT, WE DO.

SORRY, WE'RE RIGHT AND WRONG.

YOU CAN HAVE THIS DISCUSSION ALL YOU WANT.

BUT THE POINT IS, IS THAT THE ISSUE HERE IS WHETHER TO TABLE IT NOW, WHETHER WE TABLE IT TWO, IF I PICK A DATE AND WE DON'T GET THERE, WHAT KIND OF PROBLEM ARE WE IN, ARE WE INTO? OKAY.

AND I DON'T KNOW BECAUSE OF STAFF, WE ONLY HAVE SO MUCH STAFF.

THIS IS LIKE THE, THIS IS LIKE THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

THAT'S RIGHT.

THAT WAS WORKED ON FOR WHAT SUPPOSED TO ONLY BEEN TWO YEARS AND IT TOOK FOUR YEARS.

WE ONLY, AND IT TOOK ALL THE ENERGY OF THE STAFF JUST TO DO THAT.

SO HOW MUCH ENERGY ARE WE GONNA SPEND ON THIS THAT WE'RE TALKING, IT'S EASY FOR US TO TALK.

IT'S THE STAFF THAT'S GOTTA DO THE WORK.

SO ANYWAY, GOT A MOTION.

I READY TO GO FOR A VOTE ON IT.

GO AHEAD.

MOTION'S BEEN MADE AND UH, I MOVE.

THE MOTION'S BEEN MOVED.

LET'S GO AHEAD.

THE MOTION MADE BY MR. ZAREMBA IS TO TABLE PROPOSED RESOLUTION R 23 DASH ONE 13 TO APPROVE AN APPEAL BY THE COUNTY OF YORK OF THE DENIAL OF THE CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATION BY THE HISTORIC YORKTOWN DESIGN COMMITTEE FOR THE PROPERTY LOCATED AT 4 25 WATER STREET.

MR. GREEN, NO, UH, YOU TABLE IT IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

[02:30:02]

SO THE MOTION HAS BEEN TABLED TO, WE WILL FIGURE OUT SOME OTHER DATE ALONG THE LINE AND, UM, EFFECTIVELY WE WON'T BE DOING THE PROJECT 'CAUSE WE'LL HAVE TO HIRE AN ARCHITECT AND RE-ENGINEER IT.

THIS IS RIDICULOUS.

SO THAT'S JUST REALITY.

SO ANYWAY, SO THE MOTION'S BEEN JUST DONE.

SO WE'RE NOT DOING ANYTHING FOR THE REST OF THESE.

UH, REST OF THESE MOTIONS.

REST OF THESE.

PROJECT NUMBER NINE.

NINE, OKAY, LET'S GO

[10 Route 17 Widening Project – Utility Relocation.]

TO NUMBER 10.

UM, YES.

ROUTE 17 WIDENING PROJECT.

WHO'S DOING THAT? NEIL MORGAN.

NEIL, YOU'RE UP.

NEIL UP FOR NUMBER 10.

UM, SO, UH, THIS IS ABOUT THE FIFTH TIME THAT DDOT HAS ASKED US TO VERIFY THAT, UM, WE ARE IN FAVOR OF ALL THE UTILITIES ON ROUTE 17 AS PART OF THE WIDENING FROM WOLF TRAP TO GOODWIN NECK, UH, TO BE UNDERGROUND.

WE'VE BEEN SETTING ASIDE FUNDS FOR THIS.

MOST OF THE FUNDS ARE SET ASIDE.

IT'S NOT CLEAR TO ME WHY THERE'S SO MANY DIFFERENT WAYS WE HAVE TO VERIFY THAT THAT'S WHAT WE WANT TO DO.

UH, BUT THIS IS YET ONE MORE TIME THAT THEY HAVE ASKED US TO COMMIT.

AND I BELIEVE IT'S BECAUSE THE PROJECT'S GETTING CLOSE TO REAL.

YOU SEE VDOT PEOPLE OUT THERE, THEY'RE PRETTY FAR INTO DESIGN NOW, AND PROBABLY IN ABOUT A YEAR OR 18 MONTHS, THEY WOULD ACTUALLY START PAYING THE UTILITIES TO RELOCATE.

THERE'S BASICALLY TWO REASONS.

AND THE BOARD MADE A DECISION MANY, MANY YEARS AGO THAT AS ROUTE 17 WAS WIDENED, WE WANTED TO BURY THE UTILITIES.

UM, IT'S AESTHETICALLY MUCH MORE ATTRACTIVE ON OUR MAIN CORRIDOR AND, UH, PARTICULARLY IN, UM, STORMY SITUATIONS.

UM, HAVING THE UTILITIES UNDERGROUND REDUCES THE POWER OUTAGES AND CABLE CUTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

BUT IT IS EXPENSIVE.

WE HAVE TO PAY WHAT VDOT CALCULATES AS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN JUST PAYING THE UTILITIES TO MOVE THEM BACK AND KEEP THEM ABOVE GROUND AND ACTUALLY BEARING THEM WITH TRANSFORMERS AND DIGGING AND ALL OF THAT.

BUT, UH, UNLESS THE BOARD WANTS TO CHANGE ITS, UH, LONGSTANDING POLICY, UH, THIS WOULD ONCE AGAIN AFFIRM THAT THAT IS OUR DESIRE.

SO, UM, ANY QUESTIONS? NO.

NO? OKAY.

UH, SO, UH, LAST FOR A MOTION ON, UH, I PROPOSED RESOLUTION R 23 DASH 115.

OKAY, SO NOW THE MOTION'S BEEN MADE, COMMENTS BY THE BOARD.

I DO HAVE A QUESTION TOO.

QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? CHAD? NOPE.

SHEILA? NOPE.

NO.

SO THIS OKAY, STEVE, SORRY.

OKAY, SO THIS PROJECT, UM, HOW MUCH, HOW MUCH DOES THIS COST IN THE COUNTY? I THOUGHT 6 MILLION, RIGHT? BUT I COULDN'T TELL IF THAT WAS THE RIGHT NUMBER OR NOT.

UM, THE NUMBER FROM THE COUNTY IS $4,343,000.

SO 4 MILLION.

AND THE PROJECT IS WHAT? 23 MILLION? UM, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT WAS AN ESTIMATE AT ONE TIME.

I WOULD HAVE TO GUESS THE WAY CONSTRUCTION COSTS ARE GOING, IT WILL END UP BEING SUBSTANTIALLY MORE THAN THAT.

REALLY? THAT, AND THIS IS NOT EVEN A, IS IT A MILE? I CAN'T EVEN REMEMBER HOW.

NOT MUCH MORE.

MAYBE A MILE.

NOT MUCH MORE THAN A MILE.

IT DOES GO THROUGH THE GOODWIN NECK INTERSECTION, SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S PRETTY EXPENSIVE TO GO THROUGH AN INTERSECTION LIKE THAT.

SO THE, UH, MOTION'S BEEN MADE.

UH, LET'S GO FOR, UH, ROLL CALL PLEASE.

THE MOTION MADE BY MRS. KNOWLES TO ADOPT PROPOSED RESOLUTION R 23 DASH ONE 15 TO REQUEST VDOT TO PLACE UNDERGROUND UTILITY REGAL LOCATIONS RELATED TO THE ROUTE 17 WIDENING PROJECT BETWEEN WOLF TRAPP ROAD AND DEBY BOULEVARD SLASH GOODWIN NECK ROAD.

DID WE DO, UH, COMMENTS BY THE BOARD? NO, I DID NOT.

SO WE'RE GONNA GO THROUGH, I, I'VE BEEN SO LONG DEALING WITH THIS NOW, FORGOT.

UM, ALRIGHT.

SO MATTERS PRESENTED BY THE BOARD.

WHO WANTS TO GO FIRST? I'LL GO FIRST.

THIS IS A SHORT ONE.

FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO HAVE SWELTERED IN THIS WEATHER, PLEASE MAKE SURE THAT YOU HYDRATE.

IT'S BEEN THE 90 PLUS DEGREES.

MY CAR SAID 100 DEGREES YESTERDAY.

I COULDN'T BELIEVE IT.

SO TAKE CARE OF YOURSELVES.

BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, RIGHT NOW, I WANT A SHOUT OUT, IF YOU WILL, TO THE DEPARTMENT OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND TOURISM DEVELOPMENT FOR THE VIDEO THAT THEY PUT TOGETHER.

IT TOOK THEM OVER TWO YEARS TO PUT IT, PUT IT TOGETHER.

AND IT'S NOW ON CHANNEL 46 AND I THINK IT'S CALLED

[02:35:01]

CHOOSE YORK COUNTY.

AND IT'S REALLY VERY WELL DONE AND CONGRATULATIONS TO YOU BOTH.

OKAY, CHAD, REAL QUICK, WE'RE AT THE END OF AUGUST.

AUGUST 28TH.

SCHOOLS OPEN BACK UP.

ALRIGHT, SCHOOLS OPEN BACK UP AUGUST 28TH.

PLEASE DRIVE CAREFULLY, ESPECIALLY AROUND THOSE SCHOOL ZONES.

OKAY, STEVEN? YEP.

THREE, THREE THINGS.

UH, FIRST OF ALL, I JUST WANNA SAY IT WAS MY PLEASURE LAST SATURDAY TO, UM, UH, PARTICIPATE IN THE OPENING OF OUR NEW PICKLEBALL PICKLEBALL COURTS AT, UH, BACK CREEK PARK.

AND IT'S A IMMENSELY, UM, UM, ENTERTAIN A LOT OF, A LOT OF PEOPLE, A LOT OF INTEREST IN IT.

SO I'M GLAD THE COUNTY HAS COME TOGETHER AND, AND WE BUILT DEDICATED PARKS AND WE KIND OF REUSED THE SAME RESISTANT INFRASTRUCTURE FOR THAT.

I KNOW WE HAD ABOUT 150 PEOPLE OUT THERE READY TO PARTICIPATE.

IN FACT, I, I COULDN'T STOP TALKING QUICK ENOUGH TO GET ONTO THE COURT.

SO I'M GLAD TO SEE THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE CATCHING UP WITH THE REST OF THE COUNTRY AND IN THIS, IN THIS SPORT AND OFFERING CIVIL THERE.

UM, TWO, UH, I WANT TO SHOUT OUT TO OUR MANAGER OF PUBLIC AFFAIRS.

I WROTE THAT DOWN.

REMEMBER, UM, MS. MS. JEANIE FOR SO QUICKLY GETTING, GETTING UP A, UH, A VDOT PORTAL ON OUR WEBSITE.

IT'S ONE THING THAT'S OF INTEREST TO EVERYBODY IN THE COUNTY IS WHAT IS VDOT DOING ON ANY OF OUR GIVEN ROADS? AND AFTER THE READOUT WE HAVE FROM MR. CAROL LAST, LAST MEETING AT THE WORK SESSION ABOUT ALL THE PROJECT THEY HAVE PLANNED, UH, TO START, UH, COLLECTING THAT ON THAT ONE PORTAL THAT I CAN DIRECT PEOPLE TO AND SAY, HEY, HERE'S THE INFORMATION YOU'RE LOOKING FOR.

IT'S FANTASTIC.

THANK YOU FOR DOING SO QUICKLY, YOUR STAFF AND THE IT STAFF AS WELL.

AND THE THIRD THING IS, UM, JUST CIRCLE BACK WHAT WE JUST TALKED ABOUT.

I'M A LITTLE FRUSTRATED ABOUT THE, UM, THE, THE, THE FREIGHT SHED DISCUSSION.

UM, I, I DO THINK IT DESERVES MORE DISCUSSION, BUT I DO NOT THINK IT DESERVES A YEAR'S WORTH OF DISCUSSION.

THERE'S, THERE'S ONE MORE CHANCE.

IT'S SLICE TO THE PIE.

WE GET THE PARTIES TOGETHER, YOU GIVE 'EM A MONTH, FIGURE IT OUT, BRING IT BACK, MAKE A DECISION AND GET, GET THIS WORKED ON.

THERE'S NO REASON THIS NEEDS TO BE DRAGGED OUT OR KICKED OR THAT CAN KICK DOWN THE ROAD ANY FURTHER THAN THE REST OF THE SEASON.

WE GOT THE TEAM HERE AND, AND I'M A LITTLE DISAPPOINTED THAT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE VOCAL AGAINST IT AND WERE TRYING TO GIVE US FEEDBACK UP AND LEFT AS SOON AS WE DECIDED TO TABLE IT AND NOT HERE TO LISTEN.

THAT I NEED THEM, THEM TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS SO THEY CAN GIVE US GOOD SPECIFIC RECOMMENDATIONS ON CHANGES TO MAKE AND NOT HEAR.

IT'S TOO BIG.

WE DON'T LIKE THE LOOKS OF IT.

I WANT SPECIFIC CHANGES THAT WE CAN MAKE THAT WE CAN TAKE BACK TO THE ARCHITECT AND TRY TO INCORPORATE IN AND MAKE A CHANGE QUICK AND GET MOVING ON THIS.

I DON'T WANT THIS KICKED DOWN THE ROAD A YEAR.

I WANT THIS RESOLVED IN A MONTH'S TIME AND WE COME BACK HERE, VOTE ON A NEW PLAN THAT MOST EVERYBODY AGREES ON AND WE MOVE FORWARD WITH IT.

THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS FOR THE MIC.

WELL MAYBE WE'LL JUST NOT DO THE BATHROOM.

OKAY, SO I'M GONNA CONTINUE ON WITH WHAT YOU JUST SAID.

'CAUSE I THINK IT'S VERY, VERY IMPORTANT FOR THIS BOARD TO UNDERSTAND IS IT BEHOOVES THE SUPERVISORS THAT COME IN HERE FULLY INFORMED OF WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE BOARD MEETING.

SO, UM, NEIL, UH, I KNEW THIS WAS GONNA BE A PROBLEM AND, UM, THAT YOU HAVE TO GO OUT AND NOW HIRE AN ARCHITECT.

YOU GOTTA GET CONTRACT TO HIRE AN ARCHITECT, RIGHT? SO YOU, YOU'RE GONNA GO THROUGH THE HIRING PROCESS FOR THIS OR WHAT? SO LET ME JUST PAINT THE PICTURE AS I UNDERSTAND IT WITH THE IMPLICATION OF THE DECISION AND IT'S TOTALLY, YOU KNOW, Y'ALL'S PREROGATIVE TO DO IT.

UM, SO THE CONTRACT HAS BEEN BID.

SO THAT'S OUT THE WINDOW IF WE GOT AN EXCELLENT PRICE FOR THE PROJECT IN TODAY'S TERMS. SO, SO THIS IS THE COST, THIS IS COST OF THIS DECISION.

THE COST OF THIS DECISION MEANS WE JUST LOST THE CONTRACTOR.

SO EVEN IF YOU DECIDED TWO WEEKS FROM NOW TO DO SOMETHING THAT WAS JUST SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT, WE WOULD PROBABLY HAVE TO REBID THE CONTRACT, WHICH WOULD BE MONTHS IF, I DON'T BELIEVE MOST OF THE FOLKS THAT HAVE CRITICIZED IT WOULD FIND ANY MODEST COMPROMISE ACCEPTABLE.

UM, I THINK MAYBE THEY WOULD BE OKAY WITH A TOTAL REDESIGN, UH, LIKE THE BATHROOMS AND, AND NOT HAVE ANY OFFICES OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

UH, BUT THAT'S A RADICAL REDESIGN.

SO PRACTICALLY, MR. ROH, YOU KNOW, I DON'T, I DON'T SEE WHAT YOU COULD DO IN A MONTH THAT COULD GET IT BACK ON TRACK BECAUSE YOU WILL HAVE LOST THE BID.

YOU WILL HAVE LOST THE, THE WINTER CONSTRUCTION SEASON.

AND IT REALLY KIND OF FEELS LIKE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE CONFLUENCE OF ALL THE PRINCESS, YOU KNOW, NEGATIVITY, UM, KIND OF GOT IN THE WAY OF THIS.

SO, SO MY RESPONSE TO YOUR QUESTION IS, AGAIN, CLEARLY WE NEED TO DO THIS.

CLEARLY WE NEED THE BUILDING TO SUPPORT THE FACILITIES AND THE, AND THE FEATURES THAT WE SAID WE NEEDED DOWN THERE.

THAT, THAT'S, TO ME, THAT'S INDISPUTABLE.

I THINK WHAT'S ON THE TABLE AT THIS POINT IS, ALRIGHT, WHAT IS IT THAT YOU DON'T LIKE ABOUT THE AESTHETICS OF IT? AND, AND CAN WE MAKE AND CAN WE MAKE THOSE CHANGES? I DON'T THINK WE CAN WALK AWAY AND SAY,

[02:40:01]

THAT'S, THAT'S NOT ON THE TABLE.

WE GOTTA TAKE CARE OF THE BATHROOM.

WE GOTTA MAKE THE DOCK MASTER BUILDING BETTER.

WE GOTTA HAVE OUR FIRST DAY STATION, WE GOTTA HAVE THE TECHNOLOGY HUB, WE GOTTA HAVE THE SECURITY CAMERAS.

ALL THAT'S GOTTA HAPPEN.

SO IF THIS IS A MATTER OF NOT QUITE HAPPY WITH THE AESTHETICS, ALRIGHT, WHAT, WHAT, WHAT CAN WE TWEAK, TWEAK TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN? I THINK WE CAN GET THAT ACCOMPLISHED PRETTY, PRETTY QUICKLY.

THE REST OF THE REST OF IT HAS TO HAPPEN.

I'M NOT, I'M NOT ARGUING THAT OR DISPUTING THAT.

SO IF WE WANT TO TABLE IT AND WE ALREADY DECIDE TO TABLE IT, TO TALK ABOUT MAKING IT LOOK A LITTLE BIT BETTER, FIT BETTER DOWN THERE.

IF, IF THAT IS THE CASE, WE CAN HAVE THAT CONVERSATION PRETTY QUICKLY.

NOW, IF, NOW IF WE LOST THIS CONTRACT BECAUSE WE TABLED, IT'S, IT'S, AND I GUESS I GOTTA ASK, I GOTTA GUESS I ASK A QUESTION.

WHY, WHY DO WE HAVE, WHY DO WE HAVE A HAVE THE CONTRACT OUT BEFORE WE DECIDED TO MOVE FORWARD WITH IT? RIGHT? WELL IT WAS ALL CONTINGENT ON THE BOARD'S ACTION.

UH, THE WHOLE GOAL WAS TO BUILD IT OVER THE WINTER AND HAVE IT DONE.

EVERYTHING WE DO DOWN AT THE WATERFRONT, YOU KNOW, HAS THIS MAJOR SEASONAL COMPONENT.

IF, IF MAJOR STUFF WE DO AROUND HERE ALL OCCURS SEQUENTIALLY, UM, YOU KNOW, EVERYTHING WOULD TAKE A LOT LONGER.

SO THIS WAS ALL CAREFULLY ORCHESTRATED.

THE SITE PLAN WAS UNDER REVIEW.

UM, YOU KNOW, THE, THE CONTRACT WAS PUT OUT TO BID.

SO, SO FOR EXAMPLE, WE SAID, WELL LET'S NOT BID THE CONTRACT UNTIL WE FIND OUT IF THE BOARD'S OKAY WITH IT, THEN THAT WOULD'VE BEEN ANOTHER 90 DAYS, YOU KNOW, TO GET THE CONTRACT IN AND THEN YOU WOULD'VE LOST THE SEASON.

AND, YOU KNOW, MY BAD, I MEAN, BECAUSE THIS HAD BEEN ON THE BOOKS FOR SO MANY YEARS AND THE DESIGN HAD BASICALLY EXISTED SINCE COVID.

UH, I DIDN'T REALLY UNDERSTAND THAT, THAT Y'ALL WEREN'T GONNA WANT TO GO FORWARD WITH IT.

IF I MAY.

I I, I'LL BE REAL FRANK WITH YOU.

I'M DISAPPOINTED IN YOUR COMMENTS AND I'LL TELL YOU WHY.

THEY MAY BE AS VALID AS THE DAYS LONG THEY SHOULD HAVE MADE BEFORE WE WENT TO VOTE ON THIS, YOUR, YOUR POSITION WAS A LOSING POSITION.

ALRIGHT? AND SO WHY, WHY, WHY DID WE HAVE TO HEAR ABOUT THE CRYING? LET'S GET ON, AS STEVE SAID, GET ON WITH SOLVING THE PROBLEM, SET UP A DAMN WORK SESSION A WEEK FROM NOW.

GET THE RIGHT PEOPLE IN THERE, THE BOARD ARCHITECT OR WHOEVER ELSE, AND LET'S IDENTIFY WHAT WE EXPECT OUT THIS BUILDING DOWN THERE.

CALL THE DOCK MASTER'S FACILITY.

OKAY, WELL I APOLOGIZE IF I SAID ANYTHING INAPPROPRIATE.

YOU KNOW, OCCASIONALLY IN THIS JOB YOU GET A LITTLE FRUSTRATED.

YOU DON'T NORMALLY SOUND LIKE YOU'RE NO, BUT HERE'S THE, HERE'S THE THING.

NOW I WANNA COME TO NEIL'S DEFENSE A LITTLE BIT AND ABOUT THE UNDERSTANDING OF THE PROCESS.

WE HAVE TO, TO, AS YOU SAID, OR WE WAY WE'VE DONE THIS FOR YEARS IS WHAT WE'VE ORCHESTRATED A LOT OF THE CONTRACTING THE BACK OF THE SCENE.

SO WE'RE READY TO GO.

I, I WISH WE HAD KIND OF HAD THAT DISCUSSION BEFORE WE VOTED BECAUSE I THINK THE VOTE WOULD'VE BEEN DIFFERENT.

BUT THE PROCESS NOW, STEVE, IS THAT WE'RE NOT, WE AGAIN, I'LL COME BACK TO WHAT WE ARE ABLE TO DO AND THE STAFF, OKAY? THE CITIZENS WANT TO BE INVOLVED IN THE DISCUSSION.

THIS IS WHY I BROUGHT UP THE THING ABOUT THE 13 YEARS IT TOOK FOR TWO COMMITTEES TO GET THE CITIZENS TO TELL US WHAT WE WANTED TO DO.

I KNOW YOU WEREN'T THERE FOR THAT, BUT I'M GONNA TELL YOU, IT TAKES FOREVER.

AND WE'VE BEEN AT THIS THING FOR FIVE YEARS.

SO NOW WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO? WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO GO AND DECIDE WHAT WE WANNA DO.

THAT'S, I MEAN, OTHER THAN JUST GET TOGETHER, WE HAVE TO DECIDE WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO, DO WHAT WE WANT.

IF WE CAN DO THAT PRETTY, WE CAN DO THAT PRETTY QUICK.

BUT THE PROBLEM IS WE STILL HAVE TO DECIDE OR FIGURE OUT IF WE HAVE, WE HAVE TO, WE HAVE TO GO GET ANOTHER CO ARCHITECT TO COME IN OR AN ARCHITECT TO COME IN AND GIVE US SOMETHING OTHER THAN WHAT WE'VE GOT.

OTHERWISE, WE'VE JUST WASTED A LOT OF MONEY.

SO WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO HAVE ANOTHER ARCHITECT.

ONCE WE GET THE ARCHITECT, THEY HAVE TO THEN GET A, GET THE GO OUT TO BID.

AND THAT'S GONNA TAKE THAT, THAT TAKES A LOT OF TIME.

WE CAN'T DO THIS DURING THE SUMMER.

WE JUST CAN'T DO IT DURING THE SUMMER.

SO I, RIGHT NOW, IF WE STARTED, I WON'T SEE IT'LL BE IN THE SPRINGTIME BEFORE THIS ACTUALLY COMES BACK.

AND, AND THEN WHERE ARE WE? WE'RE IN TO THE SUMMER.

SO I THINK GIVEN YOUR DECISION, OKAY, WE DECIDED WE WANT TO MEET, WE WANNA ROLL UP OUR SLEEVES, GET THE RIGHT PEOPLE IN THERE, WRESTLE, IDENTIFY WHAT WE WANT IN THIS BUILDING CALLED THE DOCK MASTERS FACILITY.

OKAY? BUT THAT'S THE POINT.

WHILE WE'VE ALREADY DECIDED WHAT WE GOT, NO, WE HAVE DECIDED THAT NO, THAT THAT WAS WHAT THEIR PROPOSAL WAS BASED ON ALL THE ANSWERS.

THAT'S A PICTURE OF A BUILDING.

BUT HE'S GIVEN US ALL THIS INFORMATION BEFORE HE'S GIVEN THIS INFORMATION TO THIS BOARD BEFORE AND THE IDEA, 'CAUSE OTHERWISE NOW WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO HAVE HIM SCATTERED ALL OVER THE VILLAGE OR BE AT THE TOP OF THE, THE TOP OF, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE POST OFFICE BUILDING OR SOME LITTLE HOLE DOWN THERE IN THE, UH, SO IF I, IF I COULD JUST SUGGEST PERHAPS SOMEWHAT MORE CONSTRUCTIVELY THAN MY EARLIER COMMENTS.

UH, SO GETTING TOGETHER AND FIGURING OUT WHAT YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO DO THAT'S, AND WHAT MIGHT BE ACCEPTABLE.

THAT'S THE WILD CARD.

'CAUSE I'M NOT REALLY SURE ANYTHING WILL BE ACCEPTABLE TO, YOU KNOW, SOME, BUT, UM, ALL

[02:45:01]

THAT MAKES SENSE.

I JUST THINK REALISTICALLY IN TERMS OF THE STAFF, THE BIDS, THE ARCHITECTS, WHAT YOU'RE REALLY TALKING ABOUT IS WORKING THROUGH THAT AND TRYING TO GET IN A SITUATION WHERE THIS TIME NEXT YEAR YOU CAN DO THE PROJECT.

I MEAN, I I JUST THINK THE TIME NEXT YEAR YOU DO THE PROJECT.

YEAH, I MEAN I THINK THAT'S REALITY.

IT WOULD HAVE TO BE OUT OF THE SEASON.

YOU'VE ALREADY GOT AN A IT'S ANOTHER YEAR WASTED.

UH, OKAY, WELL I'M JUST, I MEAN, I COULD BE WRONG, BUT I MEAN, THE WHOLE PART OF US SAYING WHAT WE LIKE, WHAT WE DON'T LIKE, WHAT WE WANNA CHANGE, AND THEN ACTUALLY DOING THAT, YOU KNOW, TAKES TIME.

AND, UM, I JUST THINK REALISTICALLY, IF WE DO EVERYTHING YOU SUGGEST, THAT'S PROBABLY WHAT YOU COULD PROBABLY HOPE FOR IS GETTING IT BACK ON TRACK.

YOU KNOW, A YEAR FROM NOW WITH SOME KIND OF MODIFIED DESIGN.

I COULD BE WRONG.

I'LL OBVIOUSLY GO BACK AND ASK EVERYBODY WHAT THEY THINK, BUT I FEEL LIKE, YOU KNOW, YOU'LL HAVE TO START THE SITE PLAN OVER AGAIN.

YOU'LL HAVE TO START THE BIDDING OVER AGAIN.

I, I JUST DON'T KNOW.

HERE'S A QUESTION FOR YOU, UH, NEIL, WE GOT THE STAFF NOT JUST SITTING AROUND WAITING FOR US TO COME UP WITH RIGHT.

IDEAS.

SO WHAT'S THE STAFF, THE ENGINEERING AND ALL THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE TO GET IN AND HELP US FIGURE IT OUT, FINANCING, WHATEVER.

WHAT ARE THEY DOING NOW? THEY NOT DOING ANYTHING.

WELL, I MEAN THE PERSON IN THE MIDDLE OF IT IS, UH, BETH AND SHE'S LIKE INCREDIBLY BUSY WORKING ON ALL KINDS OF PROJECTS.

OTHER IMPORTANT THINGS, THINGS THAT HONESTLY I MIGHT SAY PROBABLY, AND YOU ALL WOULD PROBABLY SAY ARE MORE IMPORTANT.

LIKE WHAT, UM, LIKE YEAH, LIKE A MAJOR SEWER PROJECT ON A WHITES FAULKNER LIKE MANY OF THE WHAT ABOUT, WHAT ABOUT THE, UH, WHAT ABOUT THE DAM? UH, WELL, SHERIFF'S BUILDING.

THE SHERIFF'S BUILDING, WELL THE DAM IS OUR STORMWATER ENGINEERS.

THERE'S SOMEBODY, THERE'S A LOT OF STUFF PEOPLE ARE WORKING ON AND WE CAN ALWAYS CARVE OUT SOME TIME AND RESOURCES TO SAY WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO? I'M JUST SAYING REALITY IS IT'S NOT JUST GETTING TOGETHER AND TALKING ABOUT IT.

IT'S A LOT MORE TO IT THAN THAT.

AND THAT'S, THAT'S OUR POINT.

WELL, I, LISTEN, LISTEN, I, I DEAL WITH CHANGING BUSINESS PRIORITIES ON A WEEKLY BASIS AND MM-HMM.

AND NOT TRYING TO DIMINISH THE EFFORT HERE OR WHAT IT, WHAT IT TAKES, BUT IT'S NOT LIKE IT'S, IT'S, IT'S NOT DOABLE.

AND AGAIN, IT GOES BACK TO I DIDN'T REALLY HEAR ANY COMMENT ABOUT, YOU KNOW, FROM THE OPPOSITION WHETHER OR NOT WE NEEDED IT OR WHAT, WHAT IT BE USED FOR.

I HEARD CONCERNS ABOUT DID IT FIT IN WITH THE CURRENT WATERFRONT? AND TO ME THAT'S DESIGN THAT, THAT IS, UM, THAT'S VISUAL CHANGES THAT SHOULD BE ABLE TO BE MADE PRETTY QUICKLY AND SETTLED ON AND, AND MOVE FORWARD ON NOW.

UM, AND NOW ANOTHER COMMENT I WANNA MAKE.

I UNDERSTAND THE NEED TO WORK THINGS IN, IN PARALLEL.

I I I'VE WORKED WITH COMPLEX, UH, UM, UM, BUSINESS PLANS AND PROJECT PLANS FOR 34 YEARS.

I UNDERSTAND YOU CAN'T JUST DO THINGS IN A LINEAR FASHION.

UM, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, WHEN WE GET INTO THE POSITION WHERE, UM, I, WE, IF WE'RE IN A POSITION WHERE, WELL, WE'VE ALREADY DONE THESE SAYINGS AND IF YOU DON'T VOTE YES ON IT, THEN WE'RE GONNA LOSE THIS MONEY THAT PUTS US IN AN INCREDIBLY AWKWARD SPOT.

'CAUSE THEN WE, THAT MAKES US HARD TO HAVE US HAVE A A, A GOOD OBJECTIVE DECISION.

'CAUSE 'CAUSE NOW IT'S LIKE THE COST COMING BEFORE THE HORSE.

AND IF WE SAY NO, LIKE WE DID TONIGHT, WE'RE GONNA LOSE MONEY.

AND IT, IT'S, IT'S DIFFICULT.

IT'S A CHALLENGE.

BUT, UM, THAT, THAT'S A CONSIDERATION FOR, FOR THE FUTURE.

DON'T PUT US IN A POSITION WHERE IF WE SAY NO, IT'S GONNA COST US MONEY.

WE HAD IN THE MILITARY, IN THE AIR FORCE, WE USED TO CALL PUTTING US IN A SQUARE CORNER.

AIRPLANES DON'T FLY IN SQUARE CORNERS.

WELL, DECISIONS DON'T FLY IN SQUARE CORNERS.

SO THE THING IS, AND DON'T GIVE THE, DON'T GIVE THE LEADERSHIP OR DECISION MAKERS, UH, NO MANEUVERING ROOM.

SO I MEAN, WE'RE, I THINK WE'RE THERE.

ALRIGHT, SO STEVE, TAKE US IN THE CLOSED SECTION PLEASE.

OR UNLESS ANYBODY ELSE HAS GOT ANYTHING THERE.

NO, I'M DONE WITH THAT.

TAKE US IN THE CLOSED SECTION.